Josh Duggar Admits to Molestation Rumors- Part 3

[vienna]

I agree with this completely. Unless there is new evidence suggesting Josh continued this behaviour then the speculation about him being a danger to his daughters, or how sick Anna is for having Josh change diapers, is unnecessary and just makes a bad situation worse.

I also agree that no one in the family, or close to the family, would have leaked this information. If this was a current, ongoing situation then, yes, it would make sense to get it out there and get the authorities involved. But, as far as we know, this only happened over a decade ago and Josh cannot face charges due to the statute of limitations. So, the real question isn't who leaked the story but why. What was the goal? Certainly not to help the girls as I'm quite sure this revelation must be devastating and bringing them even more pain. So, who wanted to bring down the Duggars enough to put these young women through this now? Or was it, in fact, just a reporter who hit pay dirt? That seems the most likely scenario to me.

I couln´t agree more. The storie or messages this whol police report should spread in the world are:

They way conservative christians handel sexuality is wrong and unhealthy

The Duggars spanked their Kids WITH A ROD - Why has that never been amongs you "talking sweet" parental guidelines Michell? Did you spank them with a soft voice?

Focus not so much on Josh but on the envirmoent that let to all of this. Josh and his victims are a couple of people, there are thousands namles ones growing up in such an enviroment!

[Aggie2145]

To the bolded, I confess I am not familiar with Arkansas criminal law, but aren't criminal SOLs in place to protect the accused, not the possible victims? I know a victim can sue civilly up to three years past the age of majority, but are you saying that also applies in criminal cases?

The early story was that Hutchens may have completed but never filed a report and never alerted CPS or the local police. He retired not long after meeting with Jim Bob and Josh.

Criminal SoL are a two way street. They are in place to both protect the accused from claims made after all evidence is destroyed and to protect the victims who do not have the capacity to comprehend or vocalize what happened to them.

In the first thread, I posted the AR Criminal Code Provision that references Statute of Limitations (I believe it was 5-1-109). Limitations for any class of molestation are tolled until the earlier date of: the first report to the proper authorities or the victim's 18th birthday. In AR, the civil SoL is a complete toll until the victim's 18th birthday.

To start the clock on a limitations, it is not just an outcry to a police officer, it requires an official, filed report. So if the early story is to be believed, the limitations began with the Springdale Investigation.

[JBsHairspray]

Maybe this explains why JB ensures the daughters get houses, vehicles, a ton of furniture, renovations and jobs for their husbands. It's not protecting them, maybe it's guilt?

[colossians3]

I agree with this completely. Unless there is new evidence suggesting Josh continued this behaviour then the speculation about him being a danger to his daughters, or how sick Anna is for having Josh change diapers, is unnecessary and just makes a bad situation worse.

I also agree that no one in the family, or close to the family, would have leaked this information. If this was a current, ongoing situation then, yes, it would make sense to get it out there and get the authorities involved. But, as far as we know, this only happened over a decade ago and Josh cannot face charges due to the statute of limitations. So, the real question isn't who leaked the story but why. What was the goal? Certainly not to help the girls as I'm quite sure this revelation must be devastating and bringing them even more pain. So, who wanted to bring down the Duggars enough to put these young women through this now? Or was it, in fact, just a reporter who hit pay dirt? That seems the most likely scenario to me.

Since these rumors have been circulating for years I don't think it was that some reporter simply got lucky. If that was the case someone should've picked this up a long time ago when Josh was running a car lot. This seems politically motivated and was leaked at a time that could cause the most damage for Josh.

Josh has been doing a lot of speaking engagements that are anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage. This revelation, when he's calling abortion and gay marriage immoral, is quite damning for him and the FRC.

*edited to add that I agree with you that I don't think he poses a threat to his children. Unless something else is revealed I chalk this up to being brought up in a very repressed environment. In another post someone said Josh was caught looking at porn. I think he was curious and in need of therapy and was very confused about sex because of the environment he grew up in.

[lascuba]

Not just the crew...the executives at TLC had to have known. There's no way the police investigation and court appearances slipped their notice. I bet Jim Bob event old them himself, in the same way he had to qualms about telling the Keller family.

[Imrlgoddess]

I agree with this completely. Unless there is new evidence suggesting Josh continued this behaviour then the speculation about him being a danger to his daughters, or how sick Anna is for having Josh change diapers, is unnecessary and just makes a bad situation worse.

I also agree that no one in the family, or close to the family, would have leaked this information. If this was a current, ongoing situation then, yes, it would make sense to get it out there and get the authorities involved. But, as far as we know, this only happened over a decade ago and Josh cannot face charges due to the statute of limitations. So, the real question isn't who leaked the story but why. What was the goal? Certainly not to help the girls as I'm quite sure this revelation must be devastating and bringing them even more pain. So, who wanted to bring down the Duggars enough to put these young women through this now? Or was it, in fact, just a reporter who hit pay dirt? That seems the most likely scenario to me.

I agree with all of this!! As heinous as the situation already is, what purpose does it serve to put it all into a spotlight now? He can't be punished (legally)...so what's the hitch? To show that they are bad people? We already knew that. To scare the spouses? They are already too deep in. To ruin a would be political career? Possibly. None of this became an issue when he married, it wasn't an issue when he had his own business in Arkansas....this has only become an issue since he's been in Washington pushing the family's agenda and making a political name for himself. All this has succeeded in doing is bring up some painful memories for the girls and promote the twisted beliefs of their parents. Sadly, I can't say that any family's from my own youth wouldn't have acted in a similar fashion under the same circumstances.

[ariel9]

It seems the more you read, the more fails you see. Jim Bob and Michelle not only covered for Josh at the expense of his sisters but they probably also covered up to hide any of their wrongdoings. If this all had been handled in real time Josh probably would have faced criminal punishment and it is a real possibility that the parents could have had the children removed from the home. Why the children removed from the home? Well lets see there is neglect, lack of an education, and more than likely physical abuse. If Josh would have been truly punished it would have put the family under a microscope and they could lose their status symbols err blessings. With Josh having more of a chance of not living in the home with the long wait of notifying the authorities and the chance of statutes of limitation running out the timing is perfectly intentional. Another thing that seems to be rampant is that the children are scared into covering up. The interviews seem coached. They have probably been told "this is what you say because if you do not bad things will happen to your brother and your family will be broken up forever". I mean have we besides emergencies with Josie any other emotion besides happy?

[JenniferJuniper]

Since these rumors have been circulating for years I don't think it was that some reporter simply got lucky. If that was the case someone should've picked this up a long time ago when Josh was running a car lot. This seems politically motivated and was leaked at a time that could cause the most damage for Josh.

Josh has been doing a lot of speaking engagements that are anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage. This revelation, when he's calling abortion and gay marriage immoral, is quite damning for him and the FRC.

If I had to bet, it's the militantly anti-gay stance. Gay marriage is destroying the American family! Think of the children.

Right back at you, asshole.

[knit1purl1]

My SIL is **sort of** defending Josh. She's taking the "its happened a long time ago, he got help, it shouldn't be a problem now" line. :? I will forgive her not knowing the "Counciling Sexual Abuse" paper from ATI and not reading the police report though as she has far more important things - like her Pathology residency - to worry about.

My money for "Who pointed a reporter in the right direction" goes to the married girls, perhaps with a little help from one or both sets of in laws. I'm very curious what lingering LEO connections Cathy, Dan, and her second husband have and if they may have helped Jill gain some insight, which was then passed on to Jill, and/or the other girls who appear to have been interviewed in the report.

[Cassia]

It doesn't change what he did. It's too bad that the statute of limitations has run out. They're shouldn't be any for molestation.

You're absolutely right, there shouldn't be a statute of limitations on sexual assault. There isn't any up here in Canada.

[Nic]

People had the smug-pology posted yesterday, but it's nowhere to be seen on the mobile site this morning. Normally "Look at This Duggar Eat a Burger!" stays up for a week.

It is in their most read stories. I think the diff is that with the Duggars eat story is that not every other news agency is running it now as well. It's no longer an exclusive. What I also notice is that in the last couple of months there has been more than a couple Duggar likes/ tips etc. Now they just have the old Duggars know about food which I guess is bit catchier than pretending oldest son isn't a molester. Maybe next week they can start Josh's Building Tips that will include things he learned while in his time out.

[punkiepie]

I have read almost 95% of these three threads, I have a few questions:

1. Is it a fact that the person who requested the documents be destroyed is one of the victims and is still currently a minor? 2. Does this person have to be a victim or could it be one of the others who they interviewed but was NOT a victim? 3. Do we have confirmation that it was Joy who requested they requested they be destroyed? 4. How was this report allowed to be released with a FOIA request? 5. It seems like a huge injustice to the girls that it was able to be obtained this way, even if it was redacted, it still states the victims lived with their parents jb and Michelle, so how is that it any way protecting their rights? 6. The records of juveniles are always sealed unless a proceeding was done to have them declared as adults, so how was this not sealed?

[paganhomeschooler]

Just finished up part 2 and wanted to make a couple of comments:

1. When Jessa and Ben were talking to their pastor before the wedding, I thought it was odd how he asked them if there was anything that would prevent them from being married the following day, and their look/response seemed odd to me as well. I wonder if she didn't confide in him or he didn't have some knowledge of it, having been involved with the Duggars for their faux mission trips?? I know he's still not the best, but hopefully Jessa has at least gotten some sort of counsel from a person who is not a complete whackadoo?

2. For everyone saying, "14 is so young, maybe he didn't know". That is a load of bullshit!!!! My 14 yo daughter snarks on the Duggars with me. I told her what had happened when she got home from school yesterday, and she was horrified. 14 is well old enough to know right from wrong and what is appropriate and what isn't. Hell, my 11 yo daughter asked what was going on, and I told her he did something wrong to his sisters, and SHE was horrified. There is no excuse for Josh except for the marginal one related to upbringing, but even then, he was still taught those things were a sin, so sorry, not sorry.

[paganhomeschooler]

Just finished up part 2 and wanted to make a couple of comments:

1. When Jessa and Ben were talking to their pastor before the wedding, I thought it was odd how he asked them if there was anything that would prevent them from being married the following day, and their look/response seemed odd to me as well. I wonder if she didn't confide in him or he didn't have some knowledge of it, having been involved with the Duggars for their faux mission trips?? I know he's still not the best, but hopefully Jessa has at least gotten some sort of counsel from a person who is not a complete whackadoo?

2. For everyone saying, "14 is so young, maybe he didn't know". That is a load of bullshit!!!! My 14 yo daughter snarks on the Duggars with me. I told her what had happened when she got home from school yesterday, and she was horrified. 14 is well old enough to know right from wrong and what is appropriate and what isn't. Hell, my 11 yo daughter asked what was going on, and I told her he did something wrong to his sisters, and SHE was horrified. There is no excuse for Josh except for the marginal one related to upbringing, but even then, he was still taught those things were a sin, so sorry, not sorry.

[Trynn]

This is all just sick. Good god...

I do think there is concern about his daughters. He's never gotten any real help, and even if he had, the reoffense rate is sky high for pedophiles.

I don't care if he was raised in a sexually repressive environment, I wish there was a way to send this sick fuck to prison where he belongs.

Wish there was a way to help those poor girls.

[breakfree]

So I'm a SUPER long time lurker who never signed up, but I felt like I had to now because this is like the only place on the internet to post and read about this without encountering the leg humpers.

I have read every post (except the ones being made while I'm typing this) and honestly, at this point, don't have too much to add. I am really devastated that this happened. I knew for years something was not right in the family and that they could not possibly be as happy as they seemed, but I never thought it would be this (even though I also know this happens a lot more in these families than people want to believe).

The very few things I do want to 'add' to the current discussion:

1. People keep saying they are surprised or even shocked JB 'exposed' his family to fame knowing this was in the closet. I don't really see why people are surprised. Even setting aside his clear belief that he's untouchable up to this point, the truth is that when this all started, they needed money and needed it bad. I am sure it is probably the case that he and Jchelle considered the possible consequences to some degree, however minuscule, and 'prayed' on this but felt god really wanted them to have the money to go on sharing their testimony and so that was that. I also don't think, honestly, that anyone could have envisioned in the days of the early specials how well known they'd one day be. I find it highly doubtful that they envisioned days of People covers and international trips to Nepal and all the things they have now back then, and I say this as someone who absolutely never gives them the slightest bit more credit than I have to. It's true they could have stepped back a few years ago, but I think JB is not a fool about money, and he saw the money and thought gee, money is nice. Money is only second to god to these people, and they think god wants them to have money. Further, as each year passed their false sense of security probably increased. That would be normal, if an illusion.

2. I know some people are upset the records are being shredded, but I think enough attention is not being given to the possibility that it was not Joy but the unnamed fifth victim, who could indeed still be a minor herself. If I were her, I'd be getting those things shredded too, especially if the is still in the ATI or even fundie orbit. It being known it was her could seriously damage her chances of a courtship or marriage since she'd be an impure temptress, and as of right now, no one knows who she is, and if they do they aren't saying and can't prove it. Honestly, even if it wasn't her who requested they be destroyed, I am glad for her sake if she's still in that community that they are. If it was Joy, I hope she made the decision herself and was not coerced by her parents. I do think she could have valid reasons all on her own for wanting it shredded too, but unfortunately if it was her it's almost certain the parents 'forced' her to do it.

3. The Anna situation is sad and puzzling. I honestly do not comprehend how she could possibly truly have NO CONCERN AT ALL about her young daughters and Josh, and I feel true pity for her that (assuming her statement was true and drafted by her) she is in so deep that she can't see any negative implications at all in any of this. I am not convinced she knew everything though, or even necessarily that she knows everything even now. You can bet all the money in the bank she is not reading the police report and is instead trying to focus on the joy of babies and the life inside her and swallowing whatever her headship tells her. I also feel extreme pity for his kids, whether or not he is a great father to them. This will always follow them and be something they know about their dad, and I can't imagine that horror.

[lascuba]

I still don't think anyone in the family leaked. They all have too much to lose, for one thing, and I don't think any of the girls would want that kind of media attention, or that Ben and Derrick would bring that kind of attention to their wives.

If someone leaked, I'd guess it was either the person who originally contacted Harpo or someone close to them. I don't think it would be politically motivated...wouldn't anyone close enough to the community to know about it and have credible information to offer the media agree with Josh's politics?

I'm going with no one leaked. In Touch got lucky, that's it. The tabloids are always looking for juicy headlines to print, a molestation charge is the juiciest one can get, but they can't print that without actual proof. Every non-fan site that talks about the Duggars have talked about the molestation/"sin-in-the-camp" rumors for years. Someone at In Touch had time on their head so they finally decided to see if there were anything to those rumors.

[meowmeow19]

I barfed a little reading this: lorialexander.blogspot.com/

[JenniferJuniper]

If the crew knew, they would've done something. At least, I hope they would've.

Given the timing of the Oprah reporting, they had to have known. Even the ones not around at the time would have heard the story from those that were. They put their paychecks first.

[Trynn]

Some states have rules that, for sex crimes, you have a certain point after your 18th birthday when you can file a report. But I don't think all states have them, and even then it only extends to what, 3 years after you're 18?

I agree about the statute of limitations. All I've seen it do is harm victims. Too bad joshy boy isn't famous enough for this to actually change laws. It'll be a big deal for a week, and probably nothing will change.

[Aggie2145]

I have read almost 95% of these three threads, I have a few questions:

1. Is it a fact that the person who requested the documents be destroyed is one of the victims and is still currently a minor? 2. Does this person have to be a victim or could it be one of the others who they interviewed but was NOT a victim? 3. Do we have confirmation that it was Joy who requested they requested they be destroyed? 4. How was this report allowed to be released with a FOIA request? 5. It seems like a huge injustice to the girls that it was able to be obtained this way, even if it was redacted, it still states the victims lived with their parents jb and Michelle, so how is that it any way protecting their rights? 6. The records of juveniles are always sealed unless a proceeding was done to have them declared as adults, so how was this not sealed?

Responses:

1. Any victim named in the report could request its destruction - in fact any could file the request as Jane Doe. However, there is an extra layer of anonymity because the requesting victim is a minor.

2. In theory, any interviewee who was a minor at the time could request the report's destruction, however, it is a permissible destruction, not a mandatory as it would be with a victim.

3. Not sure

4. It should not have been released as a response to an Open Records request (FOIA is Federal just so you know.) I firmly believe it was leaked to InTouch - how would they even know the specific details to list in their request?

5. Again, it was never written to be released and should have never seen the light of day.

[medievalist1980]

I was really disliking Jill recently because so much was focused on her and because of her know-it-all attitude since she got married but now I see her in a whole new light and I feel very sympathetic towards her now.

Sorry, these threads are moving so quickly, I'm lost. Do we "know" it was Jill or just guessing because she is a tattletale?

[VelociRapture]

I have read almost 95% of these three threads, I have a few questions:

1. Is it a fact that the person who requested the documents be destroyed is one of the victims and is still currently a minor? 2. Does this person have to be a victim or could it be one of the others who they interviewed but was NOT a victim? 3. Do we have confirmation that it was Joy who requested they requested they be destroyed? 4. How was this report allowed to be released with a FOIA request? 5. It seems like a huge injustice to the girls that it was able to be obtained this way, even if it was redacted, it still states the victims lived with their parents jb and Michelle, so how is that it any way protecting their rights? 6. The records of juveniles are always sealed unless a proceeding was done to have them declared as adults, so how was this not sealed?

I'll give it a try:

1. The document requesting the report be destroyed stated it was a victim that is a minor.

2. I'm assuming that they would have to be a victim. I don't think a witness has the right to ask for the report to be destroyed.

3. We know that four of the five victims were Josh's sisters. At the time there were only five Duggar daughters: Jana, Jill, Jessa, Jinger, and Joy. We know one of the eldest two stated they were not assaulted, which means Jessa, Jinger, and Joy are victims. Of the three, only Joy is still a minor (she turns 18 this year). Additionally, the fifth unknown victim appears to have been old enough to babysit at the time of the assault. All this leads me to believe that the request was filed by Joy or on her behalf.

4. No clue. Maybe someone with legal expertise or who works as a Journalist can help. Each state has different laws concerning the release of legal documentation. Its possible that InTouch obtained the documents legally, but that they did so in a morally ambiguous way.

5. It is a huge injustice. However, I don't think attempting to redact the names of their parents would have helped much. We're talking about a family with a large number of children - blacking all those names out would have been a dead giveaway too. Not to mention that they names of the town they lived in was listed in the report as well.

6. Again, no clue. I'm guessing that there are different processes for different cases. Some may be sealed, but others may not be. Someone else may be able to answer.

[Toothfairy]

I can't feel bad for Josh. I hate abusers they ruin lives. Josh only cared about Josh. His apology is half ass.

[Closed Womb]

Even if I don't agree with it, I can understand why a family would protect their child (Josh), I can understand how a family can believe in Bible based rehab, and I can even believe that someone can do such a horrible thing as a child but not grow up to be a pedophile (ie, a danger to Mack) or abuser.

But, for the life of me, what I cannot understand is how parents of sexually abused daughters can make such a big fucking deal about "purity"! What the ever loving FUCK, JB and Michelle? What the ever-loving-fuck are you thinking making god-damn social construct like "purity" an idol in your house when you know what your son has done to his sisters?

What.

The.

Fuck?