Scandal Fallout - MEGA MERGE

[Nowyn]

What I think of this is that Michelle and JB are in panic mode. JB is on the phone calling to anyone and everyone. He is trying to do damage control and keep his show running. Michelle is in full panic, running around and screaming to everyone. I think Jessa and Ben are at their home trying to figure what to do next and Jill is also panicking and Derrick is trying to calm her. I think they are at their own home. Anna and Josh are trying to hide but inside Anna is very scared about future. She hasn't figured out yet that her daughters might be in danger but Josh out of a job has to be at least little scary and her future being unset has to be very scary for her. Jana is trying to keep younger kids calm who don't really know what's going on. Joy and Jinger are just trying to not break down.

[iknowright]

I think they've been on the phone with Gothard - ALOT!

[Buzzard]

What I think of this is that Michelle and JB are in panic mode. JB is on the phone calling to anyone and everyone. He is trying to do damage control and keep his show running. Michelle is in full panic, running around and screaming to everyone. I think Jessa and Ben are at their home trying to figure what to do next and Jill is also panicking and Derrick is trying to calm her. I think they are at their own home. Anna and Josh are trying to hide but inside Anna is very scared about future. She hasn't figured out yet that her daughters might be in danger but Josh out of a job has to be at least little scary and her future being unset has to be very scary for her. Jana is trying to keep younger kids calm who don't really know what's going on. Joy and Jinger are just trying to not break down.

Do we think that Josh made it out of DC? I'm assuming he had to be there to "resign". I dont know that they would want to be with the rest of the family right now.

[calimojo]

Could the letter have been from Josh? I mean maybe he had to write a letter of apology as part of his "therapy".

I don't think anyone in the family blew the whistle, at least not the immediate family. I suspect it was politically motivated, or a tabloid looking for an angle on a weird family that has been in the spotlight a lot. Any basic journalist, even from a tabloid, could look at this family and realize there had to be some dirt there somewhere. We all knew there were secrets in that home, and so would anyone who took the time to watch the show a few times.

I posted a post on another thread that didn't show up. I probably didn't notice that someone else posted before me, and instead of hitting submit I hit return or something.

ANyway, I have a few questions.

I simply don't have the time to read everything that has been posted, even thought I would love to. Can someone point me to the summary of the police report?

Also, Now, I understand why there are camera's mounted in the girl's room. We thought it was for the show, and probably was, but it may have also been to monitor other things.

I really don't think we will see any of the Duggar kids breaking away because of this just yet. They have been so indoctrinated to believe that all of this can be prayed away. I still bet that both JB and M, believe that this happened because Josh could not righteously fulfill his desires, so as soon as possible they married him off. They probably assume he is fully cured now because he now has an outlet for his desires.

The girls may eventually break free, or seek some sort of help outside the family, but again, I am not optimistic. Look at the comments from fundie public figures over the years that are so offensive and archaic about rape, sex abuse, etc. It is very clear that in that culture, sexual offenses against women are not all that unusual and that they are not considered to be a terrible thing. Instead women are told that out of the bad experience they can actually be closer to God. It twists this terrible thing into a good thing by saying it brings them closer to righteousness, etc.

While we all know it is true that surviving traumatic events can result in us realizing strength we never had before, I think we would all agree that it doesn't make the abuse a good thing just because there might be some good outcome ( strength, insight, activism,,etc) that comes from it.

My dad died when I was 10, and prior to that we were quite poor living in a very small town. Had I stayed there I probably would not have gone to college, but my mom re-married and we moved. We had a much more middle class lifestyle then, I went on to college and have a good career, marriage, family. Those are good things, but it doesn't mean that it was good for me that my Dad died. I am able to separate and understand that the death of my father was a terrible, sad and tragic event in my life. I am also able to understand that as my life unfolded, I had other things influence my life.

For the Duggar girls, I think they are probably stuck in the belief that a bad thing happened, but through prayer they became closer to God. I remember a fundie friend of mine who once said that it is a blessing to have someone sin against you, because they have given you the opportunity to practice forgiveness, which is the most godly thing you can do.

SO basically, in her world, as a victim, you should be grateful to your abuser because he/she allowed you to grow in faith. It is all so fucked up and twisted.

I think the whistleblower was political rival, or an activist for causes that Josh has viciously fought against, or a journalist looking for the story of their career.

I doubt it was anyone from TLC given their recent love fest show with the crew. Unless, someone from the crew was recently let go, or they have recent concerns that Josh is still having issues.

I doubt the family and their closest associates will do anything outwardly different anytime soon. The girls probably just don't have enough outside influence to even realize what happened was not something to just be forgotten. But the emotional issues that result from abuse have a way of coming back and when they have their own children, they may be struck with lots of discordant feelings about how they were raised vs. how they feel and love their own kids. For many abuse victims, becoming a parent can be very significant in terms of their past abuse.

[gustava]

I don't think the leak came from anyone in the family or the in-laws, as they wouldn't want to violate the privacy of the older girls or harm the children still at home with the publicity.

[jinseng]

As a possibility, the whistleblower may be associated with the most recent ATI conference in Big Sandy. JB and M were the keynote speakers...The Duggar girls spoke, along with the Seewalds, Dillards and even Josh Duggar himself had his own timeslot. The Bates also spoke a few times too. I was recently looking through the conference brochure and reading the schedule, and was quite astounded by how many speaking slots the Duggars were given. It's like they are the new poster family for ATI. It was weird. It looked like they were being treated as though they were famous, and everyone was just coming to hear them speak. With so many screwed up, broken families in ATI, the vibe of their speaking topics was sort of like 'Hey, we made ATI work, come and hear about our success!' My thoughts are that perhaps an insider there knew of the molestations. Given that Bill Gothard has been dismissed for molestation charges last year, perhaps an insider didn't want the Duggar's taking over and representing the organisation and continuing the hypocrisy.

[gustava]

I think the whistleblower was political rival, or an activist for causes that Josh has viciously fought against, or a journalist looking for the story of their career.

Agree.

[nomoxian]

This I just my theory:

I found it extremely telling that Jill and Jessa post a random selfie on instagram the day this happened. I think it was a clue, like "Yeah, we got our revenge." I don't think THEY did it necessarily, but I think their husbands found out and together did it. Ben looked SUPER uncomfortable the whole special last week. He kept glaring at Josh any time he talked. He didn't seem to want to be there. Derrick wasn't there at all for "dental surgery". Didn't he get his braces like the day after Isreal was born? Why would he be having surgery 4 weeks after getting braces? And Jill just looked sad and uncomfortable when she was interviewed.

I truly think the married couples, or their husbands, did this. They had no gage for normal until married. I HIGHLY doubt their husbands knew until well into their marriages. I would think those men would be furious about what happened to their wives.

I really hope that's true, because those young women need and deserve support.

I know if I were Derrick, if I were face to face with John, *he'd* be the one needing dental surgery once I was through with him. :sick:

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I don't think the Willis family would have had anything to do with this. I think they would like to think that if they HAD uncovered this information, they would have thought twice about continuing relations with TLC, since TLC had no way of not knowing this happened. It's just not possible. The investigation took place between the airings of the original specials. The Duggars were supposed to be on Oprah after the original special aired.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I really hope that's true, because those young women need and deserve support.

I know if I were Derrick, if I were face to face with John, *he'd* be the one needing dental surgery once I was through with him. :sick:

Josh. Not John. As far as we know, John did not harm the girls.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Amy isn't even known outside the 19KAC fandom or snarkers. Her life will be relatively unchanged. People she knows may act differently around her, but probably not since she's not a victim (as confirmed last night).

Her Nashville dreams were obviously given up at least a year ago. She's going to be married. Maybe she'll get a job. Maybe she won't.

[Yoshimi]

Honestly, when I saw the "first picture with grandpa" being 5 weeks after the birth when we KNOW that there's been contact between Jill and other family members, that told me all I needed to know. Something is going down between the Dillards and JB.

I don't know if it's related to the abuse. In fact, it may not be. But SOMETHING is happening.

Should point out that it wasn’t just the first photo with grandpa but Derick said the FIRST TIME JIM BOB HELD HIS GRANDSON. That makes it all the more disturbing, and yes, I do think that Derick’s post was a subtle dig at his father in law for not reaching out to for Jill and their baby sooner.

I thought it was really weird the Duggars didn’t release any photos of Izzy with his Duggar grandparents when he was first born, and now we know why. They literally didn’t take or want to take them. Even in that photo Derick posted, Jim Bob looks super awkward and I don’t get any warm fuzzies from him towards his grandson at all.

IMO this explains Jill’s recent subdued or sad demeanor so much. I wonder if the emotions hits her especially hard with Alyssa and Erin giving birth to their babies around the same time, and seeing how happy and loving THEIR family is for them compared to the (non)support she’s getting. I really hope Jill isn’t blaming herself for her parents being complete ******* dipwads.

[ariel9]

Josh. Not John. As far as we know, John did not harm the girls.[/qIuote]

They always say why would Jesus do? Well some of those things were flipping tables and chasing people with a whip.

[nomoxian]

Famy will just keep playing the field, babysitting, and stiffing people who offer their services.

I hate to say it, but I think that is the most likely case :(

[Toothfairy]

The letter could've been one of the girls that put it there. They had diaries I believe. Maybe they left it in there as a call for help. Or maybe they left it there by accident.

[Nowyn]

I don't think Jill even knows the damage that was done to her. She has been so sheltered that she has no reference point that tells her that what happened her is wrong. I think she thinks this is same as kiss before marriage as her parents have taught her. I was sexually abused as a child and it took years to even figure out that it wasn't normal. And then a few decades to figure out what it did to me. Even though I'm using myself as a reference point, according to what I have read it is quite normal to those things to take time.

I don't think she has the strength to make any decisions at this point. If Derick is just finding out he is probably trying to figure how to best help Jill. Even if he knew before this I think he might realize that they need real help to get trough this. I hope Cathy says something to Derick and tries to get him to get professional help.

What I fear is that Jill will develop PPD. She is already more prone to it because of hard labour and this coming out now is very bad timing. I think she also feels guilty because she was taught to be responsible of men feeling desire towards her. Also, if the show gets canceled she will feel that it was her fault. I feel really bad for her. She might have felt that she was finally getting her dream and then comes not so easy labor and now this.

[JenniferJuniper]

Do we think that Josh made it out of DC? I'm assuming he had to be there to "resign". I dont know that they would want to be with the rest of the family right now.

Even if he resigned (I doubt he did) he didn't need to be there to do it. As I recall, the house they bought in Arkansas needed a lot of work, but maybe it's done? Do we know if they were even still living in DC? Despite the 9 - 5 thing they tried to portray on the show, it seemed the nature of his job didn't require him to be in an office very often

[blueprintoflife]

I think Derrick has begun to drink the Duggar juice, yes, but I also don't think he's that far gone. He hasn't even been married to Jill for a full year. I think his mom and brother appear to have their heads on straight and I hope that they are helping Jill and Derrick realize what a serious situation this is.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I think Derrick has begun to drink the Duggar juice, yes, but I also don't think he's that far gone. He hasn't even been married to Jill for a full year. I think his mom and brother appear to have their heads on straight and I hope that they are helping Jill and Derrick realize what a serious situation this is.

Personally, I can't believe that Derick has had too much of the koolaid if they went 5 weeks without JB holding Israel. That's a very long time for a family as "close knit" as this one. I wouldn't be surprised if they "tow the line" out of obligation to the contracts not out of a want to tow the line.

[JenniferJuniper]

Considering that Bin and Mr. Dullard married these women in the first place makes me believe that they will support the Duggars; regardless of the fact their wives are the victims.

I tend to agree. But I also think it's unlikely that their wives or anyone else in their family told them about the abuse. It was buried deep; done and over.

If it is new information for Ben and Derick, I can see it eating away at them. And with Josh back in Arkansas, I sure wouldn't be allowing any sleepovers with my kids and the M-kids at Josh N Anna's.

[blueprintoflife]

Everything seems to be monitored in the Duggar household -- from phones to televisions to books. Jim-Bob and Michelle always know what they're children are seeing, reading, watching, etc. I don't see how a letter like that could just be put into a random book and forgotten about. If I had written something like that and didn't want anyone to read it, it'd be under lock and key, not folded up into a book. I don't know who I think wrote it, but I do think that by writing it, sticking it in a book, and lending the book out was definitely a cry for help.

[nokidsmom]

I think Jessa and Ben are at their home trying to figure what to do next and Jill is also panicking and Derrick is trying to calm her.

I was thinking of Ben and Derrick during this time and how they are doing.

Jessa must really be panicking but maybe this will be a sign to Ben to continue on with his schooling. I know he just graduated from CC but maybe he should consider continuing on to a four year school.

Derick must be thankful that he still has his accountant's job at Walmart HQ. One thing I was hoping was that he did not quit in favor of being on the show.

I am sure they are all in panic mode and will feel some fallout but maybe this will be good for them to make some decisions that will further their own lives instead of participating in the family dog and pony show.

[Toothfairy]

In order to get the records a request had to be made didn't it? It was a report. I think the town knew what went on. The Duggars are not popular in their circle. It had to be a plot to take down Josh and the Duggars. Benessa still depends on Bob. As well aasJillard. But maybe Jill or Jessa started opening up about their lives and the abuse slipped out. Derrick or Ben got angry but couldn't go directly to JimChelle. I do hope they encourage the girls to seek help, maybe even write a book. But I can't see that happening. Maybe a crew member on tlc got mad and started digging.

But I'm sticking with political move to take down Duggars. When I go ogled the Duggars when they first came on the additional search button said Josh Duggar molestation. So maybe someone started digging then started digging even more. Maybe the holts? Who knows. But it had to be someone they knew or someone playing dirty

[calimojo]

I don't think Jill even knows the damage that was done to her. She has been so sheltered that she has no reference point that tells her that what happened her is wrong. I think she thinks this is same as kiss before marriage as her parents have taught her. I was sexually abused as a child and it took years to even figure out that it wasn't normal. And then a few decades to figure out what it did to me. Even though I'm using myself as a reference point, according to what I have read it is quite normal to those things to take time.

I don't think she has the strength to make any decisions at this point. If Derick is just finding out he is probably trying to figure how to best help Jill. Even if he knew before this I think he might realize that they need real help to get trough this. I hope Cathy says something to Derick and tries to get him to get professional help.

What I fear is that Jill will develop PPD. She is already more prone to it because of hard labour and this coming out now is very bad timing. I think she also feels guilty because she was taught to be responsible of men feeling desire towards her. Also, if the show gets canceled she will feel that it was her fault. I feel really bad for her. She might have felt that she was finally getting her dream and then comes not so easy labor and now this.

I totally agree with this, and for the other girls as well. For all we know, they were told that what happened was normal and that all boys go through this. Or they may have been told that it wasn't normal, but that it wasn't a big deal since they were still virgins. JB and M are so messed up, we have no idea what they told the girls, but I would bet what they Did NOT tell them is this: "What happened to you should never have happened. You are not responsible for what happened and never to be blamed. We will do whatever we can to help you through this. Your brother has very serious issues and we don't consider him safe. He will not be living here in the future because of HIS actions, not because of you"

I do have a question about the end of your post. Why would Jill in particular feel that if the show gets cancelled it will be her fault? I doubt she was the whistleblower so why would she take on that blame?

I think Jill is in for a rough time. Hopefully Izzy is an easy baby, because Jill still seems to be reeling from the rough labor and dashed expectations. Now of course this has come up and even though I don't believe for one second that these girls received any kind of meaningful help, I do imagine that having to relive this is very hard, especially if they were made to feel guilt and shame over it to begin with.

I wonder if this is why they invented Side Hugs? Maybe prior to the sidehugging, they hugged normally and then were worried that Joshie boy was pressing in a bit too tightly on his developing sisters.

[onlysaneperson]

Not usually inclined to conspiracy theory, but my idle thought today was that maybe they knew all along.

When they saw that the show was going to start fizzling out anyway (e.g. older kids moving out, people pulling away), they put out the inevitable. In the meantime, they've been publicising and building up the Willis family to retain their viewers.

Maybe, these scandals just help the channel stay relevant. Who would care about TLC otherwise?

EDIT: Adding that there were multiple reports that TLC themselves leaked Mama June's situation to TMZ.