Fundy Reaction Responses to Smuggar's Guilty Verdict

[HerNameIsBuffy]

2 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

Since she is passed, I’ll zip my lips about her.

Not saying you because this is just a snark board and what we say here doesn't matter, but this attitude is a problem for people who have experienced generational trauma from abuse.

No one wants to talk about how mom didn't protect, or why grandma knew and did nothing because they're passed and nothing can be changed.  But acknowledging the harm and trying to honestly sort out why people they love who were wonderful people in many ways, could act in such incongruous ways can help victims with their healing and to avoid repeating behaviors.

Again - not about you and grandma Mary but this is so common for people trying to heal irl I wanted to mention it.

[SassyPants]

18 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Not saying you because this is just a snark board and what we say here doesn't matter, but this attitude is a problem for people who have experienced generational trauma from abuse.

No one wants to talk about how mom didn't protect, or why grandma knew and did nothing because they're passed and nothing can be changed.  But acknowledging the harm and trying to honestly sort out why people they love who were wonderful people in many ways, could act in such incongruous ways can help victims with their healing and to avoid repeating behaviors.

Again - not about you and grandma Mary but this is so common for people trying to heal irl I wanted to mention it.

I think it’s different if say for example, Jana, who might have had direct consequences disses on deceased GMM, vs me having never met or suffered from GMM’s decisions or behaviors ( or witnessed them) belittles a deceased woman who is no longer able to defend herself.

[scoutsadie]

Statement from JimBob's campaign Facebook page.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

10 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

I think it’s different if say for example, Jana, who might have had direct consequences disses on deceased GMM, vs me having never met or suffered from GMM’s decisions or behaviors ( or witnessed them) belittles a deceased woman who is no longer able to defend herself.

Which is why I said this isn't about you or Grandma Mary because it's a snark board at the beginning of my post and reiterated it at the end.

I used it to illustrate how that mindset in families hurts people irl.

11 minutes ago, scoutsadie said:

Statement from JimBob's campaign Facebook page.

This post tells you exactly who he is.  A nest of toxic spiders in a human suit.

[FaithAndReason]

20 minutes ago, scoutsadie said:

Statement from JimBob's campaign Facebook page.

Thankfully, he got a campaign promise in his statement. Phew. I was worried that his love for his children would overshadow his political aspirations. Thankfully not.

(sarcasm, fyi)

[FunFunFundie]

Again, he never says “child sexual abuse.” Constituents who don’t know about the trial could think Josh is in jail for tax evasion.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 minute ago, FunFunFundie said:

Again, he never says “child sexual abuse.” Constituents who don’t know about the trial could think Josh is in jail for tax evasion.

Well let's hope they google before they vote.

[hoipolloi]

19 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

This post tells you exactly who he is.  A nest of toxic spiders in a human suit.

He's vile. Also, he's either too fucking cheap to have someone monitoring his social media or too lazy to do it himself, because every one of the hundreds of comments since that post went up an hour or so ago has been blasting him. So far, I've seen comments in English, Dutch, Russian, French, and Spanish.

Hopefully, the people of AR will NOT vote for this piece of human garbage.

[SassyPants]

1 minute ago, hoipolloi said:

He's vile. Also, he's either too fucking cheap to have someone monitoring his social media or too lazy to do it himself, because every one of the hundreds of comments since that post went up an hour or so ago has been blasting him. So far, I've seen comments in English, Dutch, Russian, French, and Spanish.

Hopefully, the people of AR will NOT vote for this piece of human garbage.

In my family the adage is dumb and lazy are a terrible combination, but cheap and lazy works too. 

[EmCatlyn]

3 hours ago, SassyPants said:

One correction, JB owned that first house. I don’t think he and M ever rented, even as newlyweds. Also, I think JB has always misrepresented his parents’ finances. I don’t think his parents were poor or poor money managers. They owned businesses (real estate firm and yogurt shop to name 2), had rentals and set up JB with a towing company. Plus they sent JB to private school. We all know JB is a liar. We heard him lie in court. JB, like Trump, is a person who was born between 2nd and 3rd base and wants everyone to think that on his own volition he hit a grand slam while being blindfolded and having no arms. And guess what, with a little more Jesus you can do it too. JB is a fraud, and it’s starting to be exposed.

Didn’t the house they were living in when they did the first special (14 kids and Pregnant Again) belong to a church?  Were they not renting because they were living there for free, out of charity?

As for not being poor because JB spent all their money on his political campaign, I get the distinction between being poor of necessity (not enough income) and being poor because of bad management, but if you have 14 kids crowded into two standard sized bedrooms, and there is sometimes not enough to eat, I call that poverty.

[FaithAndReason]

20 minutes ago, FunFunFundie said:

Again, he never says “child sexual abuse.” Constituents who don’t know about the trial could think Josh is in jail for tax evasion.

He also never says that Josh did anything wrong. He never says "I feel bad for those hurt by my son". Only mentions child sexual abuse as if it is far off in the distance and away from the saintly Duggars. He excludes the fact that his son (and JB & M) are part of child sexual assault.

[Cam]

JB’s campaign statement only uses four sentences to address the crimes of his son Josh. How insulting. He wants to wrap it up in a pretty bow and move on? It sounds like he’s saying, “Men, you can relate to me; I’m a father, an American and a Christian. Help me add Senator to my resume.” I find it disgusting he even chose this year to run for Senator. I don’t know anyone who lives there but my bet is people from Arkansas do not want his kind of notoriety to represent their state. He becomes the story and not the state itself. He’s had too many friggin scandals. 
 

I find it incomprehensible that Anna would not be rendered speechless with anger and revulsion to find out her husband was viewing CSAM ten minutes before shopping at Lowes with her. At least that’s what it sounded like was reported. As a wife, I’d be inconsolable and unforgiving. Would she not think back to remember how he was acting at the time, any unusual behavior or speech? Would she not second-guess everything she knew to be true? 
 

Edited December 11, 2021 by Cam

[SassyPants]

17 minutes ago, EmCatlyn said:

Didn’t the house they were living in when they did the first special (14 kids and Pregnant Again) belong to a church?  Were they not renting because they were living there for free, out of charity?

As for not being poor because JB spent all their money on his political campaign, I get the distinction between being poor of necessity (not enough income) and being poor because of bad management, but if you have 14 kids crowded into two standard sized bedrooms, and there is sometimes not enough to eat, I call that poverty.

I think JB sold that home to the church. Maybe they rented back for a portion of time before TLC completed the TTH?

[Beermeet]

4 hours ago, St.Clara said:

I think this is clearly a criticism of her parents:

This can´t be about Josh. He was obviously busy doing his horrible stuff but he has not publicly condemned nor justified anybody during the last years. (Nobody would have listened to him anyway.) This is about JB and M who justified the wicked (=Josh) and condemned the righteous (=Jill). This is the exact same thing that has been said over and over in this forum (imo), only in fundyspeak.

***

I have found an impressing comment by a Christian lady on Youtube: "To Jim Bob Duggar and Michelle Duggar from a CSA Survivor". It is hard to tell how „fundy“ she actually is but she seems to imply that she is believes in submitting to her husband, so rather fundy (imo). She posted this video shortly before the conviction but I still think it fits here.

Quotes:

„The J is for Jim Bob. It was not Jesus first. It was Jim Bob.“

„If I were your daughter I would never let you see your grandchildren again because YOU DON´T CARE.“

About the show:

„Talk about pimping out your children for a buck. Shame on you.“

„I personally pray you burn in hell.“

I put it in spoilers so it does not take so much space.

  Hide contents

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=it81UJLjmMQ

 

The following quote from the comments I put in a spoiler because it is horrible (I think), trigger warning!!!:

  Hide contents

Marly Smithsonian: „...They FAILED their daughters, Josh's wife and his children. I am also a survivor and we both know his kids have been through sexual abuse. Anna said Josh LOVED to change diapers, does anyone not understand? Then they should be taken away. I pray CPS opens a case for these children and allow them to come forward and charge the parents, if Josh does not get convicted. And NO, Biden didn't cause this, The Male Duggers did. The parents refused to obey the law, and the Bible states to obey the laws of the land. They also need to have charges and their underage kids need to be put somewhere safe.“

 

Whoa, did Josh or Anna say Josh loves to change diapers?  Oh dear God no.  Thank goodness he's now in jail. Omg. I feel really sick for real rn.  

[Natalie22]

23 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

I think JB sold that home to the church. Maybe they rented back for a portion of time before TLC completed the TTH?

I believe this is what happened.  The church was expanding and so the duggars sold their house to them thinking they'd be done building the TTH.  They weren't making progress fast enough, so the church allowed them to stay in the house until they needed to demolish it.  When that happened they moved into another rental scheduled for demo.

[QuiverFullofBooks]

15 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

I think JB sold that home to the church. Maybe they rented back for a portion of time before TLC completed the TTH?

They lived in the Johnson Road house for several years. It was adequate for them at the beginning, and way too small at the end. That’s where the molestations took place. Jim Bob sold it to the church (First Baptist, now Cross Church), and the church originally said that they could stay until they finished building the new house, but they took an unreasonable amount of time, and the church kicked them out.

They obviously needed to rent, since the big house was almost done, but no landlords wanted way too many kids and counting. Finally they found a house that was going to be torn down soon that they could rent. They lived there during “16 children and moving in.” That’s where people get the idea that they lived in a crappy little rental house. Meanwhile, the church tore down the old house, and Jim Bob took the kids to watch (which was filmed). Oddly, the church never built over it; you can still see the foundation.

[ifosterkittens]

JB is one of four running for the Republican seat, so those voting for the Republican seat have three other options. 

https://www.arkansasonline.com/news/2021/dec/06/four-candidates-contest-special-republican/

[TuringMachine]

Hey Jim Bob, did you know you have daughters too? Daughters who might be hurting right now because private, traumatic parts of their lives have been shared publicly. Again. Things you said under oath that you didn't remember happening to them. 

I ask cause it seems like you might have forgotten who the victims are here. And it's not your son.

[lumpentheologie]

1 hour ago, Jinder Roles said:

Reformed theology is very harsh but also the only one that makes logical sense to me. I’ve never understood how God could be good if he is the orchestrator of all. Growing up I often questioned how we could have free will if God is all-powerful. The power dynamics are wonky. 

It's really really hard to solve the problem of salvation vs eternal hell if you're committed to God being completely good, all-powerful, and all-knowing. That's why there are so many disagreements and versions that favor some of those attributes over others.

Reformed theology sticks with all-powerful and all-knowing but really messes up the idea of good so that good = condemning people who lived totally normal, decent lives to be tortured in hell forever. It also means most people with this theology are regularly having anxiety attacks about whether they're actually saved, since you really can't know. (And it can actually encourage such anxiety as a potential sign of salvation, since being pridefully sure of your salvation looks a lot like sin. The Puritans used to have ritualized, public anxiety attacks at their prayer services for exactly this reason. What a terrible life.)

Evangelical theology tries to give people more of a fair shot at salvation with more free will, but if it's truly up to us to decide then God can't really be all-knowing if we haven't decided yet. 

Honestly it's never made sense to me that God could justly torture anyone for all eternity, even the worst of the worst, since that's by definition hugely disproportionate to whatever terrible things they could have done during their limited lifespan. The only doctrine that I think wraps it all together is the doctrine of apokatastasis -- mostly associated with the 3rd century church father Origen, it means that we are all falling away from God, but God has a plan to catch each of us and bring us back to him eventually, a different plan for each of us depending on our unique circumstances. In this case God's infinite goodness, knowledge, and power work to improve and eventually perfect everyone (after some chastising torment for some). 

But of course once the Church achieved real worldly power (after the collapse of the Roman Empire a few hundred years later) it declared this doctrine to be heretical -- it's just so much harder to control people without the threat of eternal torment. 

[waltraute]

'The entire situation with my son' could easily stand in for 'Josh being unjustly convicted'. Never once does Jim Bob admit Josh's guilt or that justice was served. 

It's a non apologetic, insincere, non-statement and it's disgusting. 

[Beermeet]

I'm going to be happy if Jason and Josiah are going against the grain.  Good for them..  stand up for what is right and clearly not  normal.  Josh is no Apostle rn. Any kid that can ( over 18 or married at least, I suppose) disagree with how JB&M are handling this situation as well as their entire lives, ultimately if they keep thinking, I applaud them.  This could get real ugly and I'm here for it.   JB&M have a lot to answer for, that M. Kelly interview did NOT age well. 

For the parents to brush it off as " boys will be boys" and " every family has this problem " is insulting as all hell for the not Josh brothers.  They have no such um...unsavory proclivities so, they are intensely upset and disgusted like we are, I imagine.  It's their sisters who they love.  It's really bad.  Not much is worse than your sisters being molested by your brother, who likes csam, and your parents have his back and are delusional.   I feel for them, all the Duggar kids and grandkids.  Except Josh, of course. 

[marmalade]

Lori banned me, but has anyone posted her apologetic garbage here yet? There's more than one post. Saying shit like one bad apple doesn't make the Duggars bad people, etc.

[neuroticcat]

5 hours ago, SassyPants said:

One correction, JB owned that first house. I don’t think he and M ever rented, even as newlyweds. Also, I think JB has always misrepresented his parents’ finances. I don’t think his parents were poor or poor money managers. They owned businesses (real estate firm and yogurt shop to name 2), had rentals and set up JB with a towing company. Plus they sent JB to private school. We all know JB is a liar. We heard him lie in court. JB, like Trump, is a person who was born between 2nd and 3rd base and wants everyone to think that on his own volition he hit a grand slam while being blindfolded and having no arms. And guess what, with a little more Jesus you can do it too. JB is a fraud, and it’s starting to be exposed.

I think they did buy their first house. I believe it was a foreclosure or something like that and they saved up bought it and flipped it. Their first book goes into great detail about how they shrewdly built up their finances. If it’s true, they did work hard - JB worked several jobs and they had the car office in their living room. The sense I got was that they could have had nicer things and not been under poverty line, but they were constantly investing to build wealth.

It’s always interesting how much greed can be hidden under “stewardship.”

[Womble]

It seems weird that Josh is the only one in his family like this. What made him like this?? And what should have been done after the early incidents? I agree his family did not handle this well, but I’m struggling to see what could be done. I’m not apologising for his family and all their issues, but in reality what can be done with someone like this?

[EmiSue]

1 hour ago, Beermeet said:

Whoa, did Josh or Anna say Josh loves to change diapers?  Oh dear God no.  Thank goodness he's now in jail. Omg. I feel really sick for real rn.  

Does anyone know where this was said? I couldn't find the source in a quick Google search.