Bro Gary Hawkins 23: Give Us the History

[thoughtful]

1 hour ago, Ozlsn said:

I hope that she is safe as well. "Turning him in"... for what I wonder? I can think of a few obvious things here, but not if it's an affair.

The "jody" (I learned a new term today! That's what James called him, but this man actually doesn't fit the definition, since James is not stationed far away, and isn't even in the military any more) is in the Marines. There are rules in the US military about infidelity. From various sources, here's what I could find:

Quote

Article 134 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice makes criminal the act of adultery when certain legal criteria, known as “elements,” have all been met. There are three distinct elements to the crime of adultery under the UCMJ: first, a Soldier must have had sexual intercourse with someone; second, the Soldier or their sexual partner was married to someone else at the time; and third, that under the circumstances, the conduct of the Soldier was to the prejudice of good order and discipline in the armed forces or was of a nature to bring discredit upon the armed forces.

Quote

The maximum punishment according to Article 134 (Adultery) is a Dishonorable Discharge, forfeiture of all pay and allowances, and confinement for one year.

 

[thoughtful]

Becky removed the post about Chau from her Facebook page.

ETA - new post from Gary. He has a new grandson, so of course he posts all about his joy.

I kid, I kid. We now have "they are Biblically" to add to "It BIBLE!'

Quote

Ok folks things i Believe.

And I know some will disagree and that fine but I believe them because they are Biblically.

1 the KJB is GOD written words for English language. The devil has others GOD only give us one. HE isn’t the author of confusion.

2 Salvation is the only way to heaven through JESUS only. You must be born again. Be draw and convicted by the HOLY SPIRIT. No works of any kind for Heaven.

3 after Salvation and disciplining there will be a change in lives. Change from inside out.

4 there is a difference in a CHRISTIAN and a saved person. CHRISTIAN or CHRIST like. Some Saved people live there lives to themselves.

5 I am a Baptist and not ashamed of it. Ashamed of a lot of Baptist. And the reason I’m a Baptist is because the History of it. I know I have some that aren’t Baptist and that is your choice but as for me I’m know why. And with a open mind Heart and open Thinking and lots of study.

6 Hell is for those is for those that rejected JESUS. It is still in the center of the earth and people without CHRIST go there. It talk a lot about hell and the lake of fire. So please don’t go to hell.

7 Holiness is still Biblical a man is to look like a man and a woman is to look like a woman. Pants is for men and dresses and skirts for women and below the knees. It says it in the KJB and look at these bathrooms you go it it will tell you. Also when children grow up not know who is mom and dad then we have transgender. I know I will be hit hard on this but would rather know the truth now then later and stand before GOD and be rebuked. Nakedness is a sin.

Last of all because Preachers have quit naming sins we are where we are. Preachers that won’t preach and name all the sins is guilty of doing those sins. Just something I Believe and with the help of the LORD I will till I go.

Bro Gary Hawkins

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by thoughtful

[Xan]

This part I found interesting:  "Some Saved people live there lives to themselves."  Poor spelling aside, does Gary really think that all you have to do is believe the correct way?   You could live a hermit's life and still be saved because works don't matter at all?  I know the answer is yes but it's still bewildering.  Even the fundiest people I knew from my childhood thought you had to sometimes do good works for others.

[thoughtful]

Well, I spoke too soon. Gary does appreciate his grandchildren.

Of course, it's still confusing, as usual with Gary. Becky and Gary weren't in church for either service today, and I figured they were on their way to meet their new grandson, but now I'm confused by Gary's wording.

It sounds like someone else came and picked up their granddaughter, and he and Becky haven't gone to meet the new grandson yet (despite his saying he loves his time with his grands, plural).

Well, it actually sounds like she just went off on her own - hitchhiking or riding a tricycle from Tennessee to North Carolina, perhaps?

I listened to a bit of tonight's service - enough to hear Pastor Baker say this:

"There's a - I don't know how far this goes back to, but there's a musical and a show and things - Less Miz, or Less Miserowls, it's a French, uh - how many have hearda that - you know that story, Less Miz?"

I wouldn't gloat over most people mispronouncing it, or even not knowing it was a famous novel from the 1860s, but this guy is so full of himself, I just loved it.

[AmazonGrace]

Gary, I have some Bad News for you

Spoiler

Also, very little in the Kjv about transgender bathrooms.

When Gary say it biblically Gary mean it Gary opinion

 

[Alisamer]

I think the "war on Christmas" and anti-happy holidays thing is ridiculous. Just more made-up outrage to keep the stupider of our voters riled up and angry about something so they are distracted from noticing how terrible the people they vote for are. 

I occasionally will meet someone who very pointedly says "Merry Christmas" in a way that makes it clear they think they are being subversive or anti-woke or something. It's dumb. I always tend to reply either with "you too" or with "Happy Holidays!" depending how annoyed or confrontational I'm feeling that day. 

I often use "happy holidays" myself just because there are so many holidays around that time. I have before responded to "it's MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!" with my sweetest southernest "well, I was hoping your new year's would be good, too!"

But I get some people not being cool with any holiday references and tend to kind of follow the other person's lead, generally. When I've been asked to make a business holiday card, even for our "it must say Merry Christmas!" Trump-loving former co-owner, I generally go with "Happy whatever you celebrate" sort of things, even sometimes using a bunch of different holidays as a background pattern to the card. 

[thoughtful]

1 hour ago, Alisamer said:

But I get some people not being cool with any holiday references and tend to kind of follow the other person's lead, generally.

Thank you for that.

We can all agree that the pushy folks who want the whole world to conform to their way of life are repulsive, and that a specific holiday wish when you know what the other person celebrates is great.

I just always like to chime in that, if you really think about it, when talking to strangers who don't give you a lead to follow, "happy holidays" is no more appropriate in November and December than it is at any other time of year.

On a related side note, this was the description for the latest Spoonflower design challenge:

Quote

December may be a popular time to gather with family and friends, but customers come to Spoonflower year-round to celebrate holidays and we want your shop to be ready for them. This week your challenge is to create a design perfect for these other holidays. Will your design adorn the table linens of a romantic Valentine’s Day dinner or a kid-friendly Mother’s Day brunch? Will it be printed on fabric for a handmade Father’s Day gift or St. Patrick’s Day apparel? We can’t wait to see which holidays you bring to life this week. 

Doesn't that sound to you like entries were supposed to avoid December holidays? It does to me. But, besides a few Christmas designs, there were quite a few Chanukah and New Year's Eve entries.

In general, I'm fine with artists being free and iconoclastic - sometimes it's all about breaking rules. But, if one is entering a challenge with parameters, it seems like a good idea to try to stay within them.

The reason it relates, to me, is that it seems like some people skimmed the description, thought "OK, not Christmas" or "yeah, other holidays, equal time for other December holidays" and completely missed the point.

A lot of the designs, whether following the rules or not, were really trite, dollar-store-wrapping-paper dull, too.  People who enter these challenges vary, and often honor minority populations and lesser-known ideas and images, but there wasn't much variety this time.

I ended up voting for a funny Groundhog Day damask, a pretty floral interpretation of arrangements of diwali candles, and a design for National Bird Day.

In other news, James Bessinas has changed his Facebook picture to one of just his kids (he previously had one that included his wife), and his banner to these verses:

 

Spoiler

 

Not sure if he is capable of introspection, and is trying to humble himself, is aiming this at the man he thinks took his wife away, or what. But I guess it's better than if he posted 1 Corinthians 6:16, or other verses about harlots, wifely submission or discipline.

Edited November 20, 2023 by thoughtful
riffle

[AmazonGrace]

The way men is italicized there sounds like God is not thought likely to give women any wisdom

Sounded like a dig.

But I guess it happens in some versions of KJV

weird italics in random places here too

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/James-Chapter-1/

[thoughtful]

23 minutes ago, AmazonGrace said:

The way men is italicized there sounds like God is not thought likely to give women any wisdom

Sounded like a dig.

I noticed that, as well, and who knows what he thinks about it.

I looked it up, and it seems those are words that were not there in the original Greek, Hebrew or Aramaic, but inserted (or something was re-interpreted) to fit with Elizabethan English.

You know, for that infallible, God-inspired, only true bible.

[AmazonGrace]

It would be fun to know how God managed to give a bunch of 17th century translators the inspiration for infallibility. But somehow he's been unable to inspire anyone for the same for any later translation

How about German, French, Italian, Swedish, Swahili, all the other language translations? Which of them are infallible and which aren't?

[thoughtful]

This again. Boring.

Also, Gary, you are lying - you tell stories about going to a brick and mortar school, so we know you were not homeschooled, at least not entirely.

Spoiler

 

[Alisamer]

21 hours ago, thoughtful said:

I noticed that, as well, and who knows what he thinks about it.

I looked it up, and it seems those are words that were not there in the original Greek, Hebrew or Aramaic, but inserted (or something was re-interpreted) to fit with Elizabethan English.

You know, for that infallible, God-inspired, only true bible.

Since "God isn't the author of confusion" it's odd that God would have chosen to stick with a very, very, VERY old no longer spoken version of English to stick with, isn't it? Seems like to avoid confusion he'd make sure there was a version every century or so to accommodate changing language and maybe even clarify how his rules apply to life that is very different than the ancient Middle East!

I think people like Gary enjoy the fact that their chosen Bible is pretty confusing. They don't understand it either, but it's easier to fake like they do when the congregation understands even less of it. It's also easier to make it say what you want it to say, if you don't understand half the words and any of the context.

I don't know what I'd prefer, Gary admitting he went to a normal school, or Gary lying and saying he was homeschooled his entire education. 

Based on his posts, I'd say homeschooling, because that reflects less badly on the state's public education system. But also it's annoying when he lies about things, since I'm pretty sure lying is generally considered sinful yet he is teaching people how to be Godly. Supposedly.

[AmazonGrace]

"I never got an education, I am stupid and happy the way God made me".

[Alisamer]

17 minutes ago, AmazonGrace said:

"I never got an education, I am stupid and happy the way God made me".

That's Gary in a nutshell.

With an added side of "and I'm holier-than-thou about it!"

[Xan]

I think Gary has just a high enough level of awareness to know that he's not very smart and he's not successful.  However, that doesn't sit too well with his feeling that he deserves better.  He has to be holier than thou and most beloved by God to make up for the reality that he has few gifts and never used the little he was given.

I believe that everyone has some gift or talent.  Maybe you're good a math or you have a way with plants.  I once taught a class of teenagers with cognitive impairments.  One of the girls taught me to crochet.  I imagine even Gary has something that he, at one time, could do well.  Whatever it is, it certainly isn't speaking, preaching, or having people skills.

[AmazonGrace]

you don't have to be good at anything if you can put down people who learned something.

Those kids were taught stuff?  well never mind, they can't tell whether they're cows or humans

[thoughtful]

21 hours ago, Xan said:

I imagine even Gary has something that he, at one time, could do well.  Whatever it is, it certainly isn't speaking, preaching, or having people skills.

This is an interesting thought experiment. I don't know that he ever could do anything well, but he might have had the potential to do so.

I'm guessing, of course, but I lean towards Gary's not learning when he was young being a combination of his parents not caring about education, his oppositional tendency, and probably some actual learning disabilities that were never properly addressed.

Maybe his "I don't wanna and you can't make me" is just his personality (his siblings seem less intensely oppositional and obtuse to me), but perhaps it came from embarrassing failures in school. We don't know if he had decent, kind teachers or shitty ones in his brief (?) time in public (?) and Christian schools. We don't know exactly when they moved to and from NC and SC (I'm pretty sure Gary was past school age when they went to SD), but that could have been damaging to any progress he might have made.

Danny's becoming super-intense about being a fundamentalist Baptist happened when Gary was three, according to Gary. So he was at an early age developmentally when that took over (and, I think, disrupted) their lives. It sounds to me like, other than a bit of gardening, that became all Danny cared about from then on.

So it's really hard to imagine what potential Gary might have had. I'm trying to think of what he might have been able to do, with good parenting and education, and nobody in his family idolizing the role of preacher.

If he'd been guided in critical thinking, he might be a happier person who doesn't fall for every conspiracy theory, and better able to learn and adjust to new situations.

If he'd had the help he probably needed to tackle language more comfortably, I think he'd be a much less frustrated, angry person, as well as having more opportunities. His language skills are so bad that he sometimes reminds me of a toddler in that stage where they are getting more and more frustrated with not being able to talk about what they want.

But I'm still not addressing what specific things he might have done, if all of the above had changed in his upbringing.

If Danny had stuck with farming, was good at it, and knew how to involve his kids in the work without fear or abuse, Gary might have had some skill at that, and gotten some satisfaction from it. He's shown some interest in it - growing vegetables, the chickens and ducks - and seems to get pleasure from that.

If Gary had shown any mechanical aptitude, he might have been able to learn electrical or auto repair work, or plumbing or construction. But we don't know if he ever showed any potential for such work. He's lazy when it comes to physical work now, but maybe if he'd been doing it when younger, and had gotten educated enough to rise to a more supervisory role, he'd be doing well in such a role now. Of course, his father set a shitty example for that, if he did, in fact, quit Duke Energy after 4 days of marriage, as he claims.

In either farming or skilled labor, Gary might have gained some liking of working alone or with a few other people, without gabbing all the time, or just exchanging normal chat about the work or jokes (although, come to think of it, I don't really know if Gary yammers on all the time - he might be one of those people who doesn't converse much, if he's not preaching).

I don't see the faintest glimmer of artistic, academic, medical, business or musical potential in Gary, but that could be because of how incredibly unsuited to any of those things he is now.

Maybe, with better language skills and less anger, he'd be good at sales. He certainly seems to like the role of thinking he has something valuable and wanting to persuade others of its value.

Edited November 22, 2023 by thoughtful
riffles, clarity

[thoughtful]

Speaking of Gary and conspiracy theories:

Comments:

Spoiler

 

Edited November 22, 2023 by thoughtful

[Xan]

I've run into this problem while thinking about Jill and the Noyes family.  Where exactly did someone drop the ball and decide that critical thinking skills weren't necessary?  It turns into a Russian nesting doll mess.  For Gary, the first obvious problem was his dad, Danny.  That man is even less rational and fluent than Gary.  Did Danny's parents push religion or did he have some need of his own to be a self-made authority? 

The lack of pride in actual work is another fundie puzzle.  It would seem that, if you believed everything you do is for the Lord, you'd try to be a better worker.  It doesn't seem to Gary (or David Rod) that anything matters beyond saving souls.  Sure, you need people in this world to fix your car engines, care for you if you're sick, and prepare your restaurant meals.  It just never seems that fundies consider those to be viable career paths.

I think Gary could have been a halfway decent farmer if his dad had passed on a normal work ethic.  If Gary had some success in raising chickens or growing tomatoes, that could have been the boost he needed to feel competitive in the secular world.  The problem is that Gary is lazy and we'll never know what he might have become.  If you stunt children by not educating them, not patterning reasonable adult behaviors, and not encouraging them to follow their own interests, you end up with Garys.  This is one reason I worry about the Rod kids.

Edited November 22, 2023 by Xan

[thoughtful]

Gary's sister Kim posted that Jacob went with her to clean Danny's house, so I guess he is spending some time with Gary's family (and, it sounds like, still being used for grunt work).

Another comment under Gary's post about cashiers asking if you want a receipt, and how . . .

Spoiler

 

Donnie:

badly, not bad.

they're, not there.

I think "taking you" is what you meant. "Taking you over the coals" is meaningless - the expression is "raking you over the coals," and it has nothing to do with cheating someone financially. Either way, "taken" isn't right.

And did you use emojis Gary has blocked? Were they cussin'? Bad boy.

[Ozlsn]

On 11/21/2023 at 6:36 AM, AmazonGrace said:

It would be fun to know how God managed to give a bunch of 17th century translators the inspiration for infallibility. But somehow he's been unable to inspire anyone for the same for any later translation

How about German, French, Italian, Swedish, Swahili, all the other language translations? Which of them are infallible and which aren't?

According to John Shrader the only infallible translations are his personally approved ones... not that he's literate or fluent in the languages being translated into!

[thoughtful]

Becky and Gary were not in church tonight. Pastor Baker started the prayer requests by asking the congregation to pray for Becky, because she's "had some bad days with her MS."

[thoughtful]

Gary has posted (pre-edit, first edit and second edit versions):

Spoiler

Edited November 23, 2023 by thoughtful
punctuation

[thoughtful]

Gary the turkey fryin' chef was live on Facebook. He shows us a turkey:

Spoiler

Yeah, I bet most of you saw that coming - even non-dads sometimes give out with a dad joke.

He says: "Tsk - OK, folks, ah'ma turn this aroun',  we're startin' our process of uh - what? 'z'gonna turn it aroun' there it goes right there -"

Spoiler

"Starting our process of  cookin' eight turkeys today. So, startin' th'heat. Gittin' ready. Got eighta these bad boys t'cook. Pray ever'body has a good day an' a happy Thanksgivin', an' remember Jesus loves ya. An' if ya ain't saved, y'better be thankful God's give ya another day - t'be - t'get borned agin. Have a good day."

He pans around the pot, and we get this view:

Spoiler

I know nothing about cooking outdoors with propane, but I am a worrier when it comes to safety, and I did look up some advice online. That tank seems awfully close to the flames, to me.

Gary, they make long propane hoses - go get one, to make sure you get another day.

Since he's frying eight turkeys, I imagine he is doing this for others, as well as his own household - in previous years, he's advertised that he'd do it for a fee, so he may be doing that again.

Edited November 23, 2023 by thoughtful
riffle

[Xan]

There's so much wrong with this.  The pot does look too close to the propane.  Is the bottom of the pot supposed to look all burned like that?  Should he have a different pot or maybe the pot should be elevated from the flames?  And Gary handling raw poultry?  Not sure that's a good idea...

Gary, out in the yard all day with hot oil, a propane tank, and no visible safety equipment -- I'm just glad I'm not a next door neighbor.