Jinger Duggar Vuolo 61

[marmalade]

47 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Tia Levings talks about going from IBLP to Calvinism like Jinger. She said it actually made things worse in some ways. 

I haven't read the book yet (soon!). How was Calvinism worse? 

[JermajestyDuggar]

10 hours ago, marmalade said:

I haven't read the book yet (soon!). How was Calvinism worse? 

She’s said that when they went from iblp to Calvinism, she thought it was freeing because she could wear pants.  But she describes the beliefs as darker, colder, and harsher in the beliefs. Like for instance, there’s a core belief that at the beginning of time, god chose a set number of individuals that he will grant salvation and there’s nothing you can do to change that. Which is such a pessimistic way of looking at it. TULIP is an acronym of what they believe. The T stands for Total Depravity. All humans are born enslaved to sin. And they are born bad. It’s just a really negative view of human beings and sin. I’m sure some other people here know more. But Jinger just jumped from the frying pan into the fire. 

[SassyPants]

On 8/23/2024 at 2:02 PM, Coconut Flan said:

Derrick doesn't seem to have a lot of diplomacy in him.  Jeremy, though, seems to have much of the thoughtfulness that both his parents seem to have.  Added to that being the second couple and Jeremy planning from the get go to "handle" Jim Bob and I'm guessing he was smart enough to get some input from his father into dealing with the situation and they've been able to put forth a more polished and more diplomatic message.  

Another thing I remember that Jeremy mentioned several times when talking about JB during the Purity podcast. Jeremy  mentioned that since having daughters he better understands how JB treated/treats male suitors for his daughters. I think this helps him better relate to and engage with JB. Jeremy said he will also be hard on any males wanting to date his girls. Currently, Derick does not have these same experiences.

[Mrs. Kravitz]

17 hours ago, AussieKrissy said:

I think an element was because it got  leaked (am I remembering correctly) they were courting or pre courting and no way back then could They  look Like heart pieces were being lost. Who knows what would have happened if it hadn’t of been leaked. Though to be fair Jess did seem pretty set on him.  
Imagine if a Titus and Lauren happened on the show. Lucky it didn’t because that marriage would have happened just for Jb to save face. 
We dont know what happened to that couple but at least a marriage that was not meant to be did not happen. A poor 19 kids and counting girl would have been stuck. 

She strikes me as the type who once she sets her mind on something, she's going to do it, even if it seems like it's just out of spite. I think the marriage would have happened regardless of it being leaked. I imagine his pliability was a bonus to her. 

[GuineaPigCourtship]

I remember reading sermons from fire-and-brimstone Calvanist preachers in my English class and thinking "what a hopeless belief system."  I mean I doubt a mega church is that negative in their preaching, but it certainly doesn't seem like a fear-free path to Christ.  Lots more leaning on the vengefulness of old testament God and less on the love and forgiveness of New Testament Jesus/God.

[FiveAcres]

Yeah. "Sinners in the hand of an angry God." Way to teach people your God is an asshole.

 

[Jinder Roles]

@JDuggs Thank you, I think Plathville is the most interesting of the fundie shows because of the lack of religion. 
 

*gets on soapbox* I hate Calvinists so much. They love apologetics and intellectualising everything (Books is very on brand) and yes it is a very callous theology. In some ways I get it because if you try to reason out fundamentalist faith then the only logical conclusion is that God predetermined everything including who is worthy of salvation and free will doesn’t exist. However I have no idea how they are so ok with this realization. Saying it’s not a fear-based theology is very misleading. 
 

On top of that I find fervent conservative Calvinists to be some of the most insufferable people ever. They use respectability and fancy arguments  to disguise some of the most abhorrent viewpoints.

*gets off soapbox*

[JermajestyDuggar]

6 minutes ago, Jinder Roles said:

@JDuggs Thank you, I think Plathville is the most interesting of the fundie shows because of the lack of religion. 
 

*gets on soapbox* I hate Calvinists so much. They love apologetics and intellectualising everything (Books is very on brand) and yes it is a very callous theology. In some ways I get it because if you try to reason out fundamentalist faith then the only logical conclusion is that God predetermined everything including who is worthy of salvation and free will doesn’t exist. However I have no idea how they are so ok with this realization. Saying it’s not a fear-based theology is very misleading. 
 

On top of that I find fervent conservative Calvinists to be some of the most insufferable people ever. They use respectability and fancy arguments  to disguise some of the most abhorrent viewpoints.

*gets off soapbox*

It sounds just perfect for Jeremy. Who seems to think he’s smarter and better than people like Jim Bob and Gothard. 

[Kiki03910]

23 hours ago, marmalade said:

I haven't read the book yet (soon!). How was Calvinism worse? 

It seemed worse for her husband (thus MUCH worse for her) because there weren't as many rules in place. He seemed to need a rule for every little thing and was lost without that structure. Add in severe mental illness. Those sections of the book were frankly terrifying.

[SassyPants]

On Today’s Podcast: Jana’s wedding-

It was small- 450 people (J/J’s 1200 people)

It was sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet

The only children invited were Duggar and Wissmans- weren’t there Bates’ GKs in attendance

Jana was so patient in waiting for the one

Jinger can never get to see all of her sibs on a 2-3 day visit. WHAT- Jinger could stay in Arkansas for 2 weeks- what’s to stop her? Jim Bob?

Jana, Michelle and some of the sisters came to CA for a bridal weekend in Santa Barbara earlier in August

[JermajestyDuggar]

9 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

On Today’s Podcast: Jana’s wedding-

It was small- 450 people (J/J’s 1200 people)

It was sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet

The only children invited were Duggar and Wissmans- weren’t there Bates’ GKs in attendance

Jana was so patient in waiting for the one

Jinger can never get to see all of her sibs on a 2-3 day visit. WHAT- Jinger could stay in Arkansas for 2 weeks- what’s to stop her? Jim Bob?

Jana, Michelle and some of the sisters came to CA for a bridal weekend in Santa Barbara earlier in August

I think she meant that since she has so many siblings who are married with kids, it’s hard to get to visit with all of them in a 3 day visit. That’s your sign right there that you have too many siblings. I have two siblings. I can easily visit with them when I visit my hometown. It doesn’t take much effort or time. 

[SassyPants]

50 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I think she meant that since she has so many siblings who are married with kids, it’s hard to get to visit with all of them in a 3 day visit. That’s your sign right there that you have too many siblings. I have two siblings. I can easily visit with them when I visit my hometown. It doesn’t take much effort or time. 

I was just wondering why she limits her stays to 2-3 days. It’s not like she has an in-person job, and Felicity just started school (maybe last year). 

[ihaveanexamintwodays]

On 8/26/2024 at 12:12 PM, SassyPants said:

Another thing I remember that Jeremy mentioned several times when talking about JB during the Purity podcast. Jeremy  mentioned that since having daughters he better understands how JB treated/treats male suitors for his daughters. I think this helps him better relate to and engage with JB. Jeremy said he will also be hard on any males wanting to date his girls. Currently, Derick does not have these same experiences.

The biggest thing I've heard JinJer say that explains their "breaking free" and remaining on "good terms" with JB compared to the Dillards is that JinJer decided not to make MONEY an issue. And that's the god JB lives by. Jeremy was older &so their family was never as financially dependent on JB, whereas Jill was much more of a moneymaker for JB than Jinger (both in the family home, i think, and also as a face of the brand) AND Jill and Derick had more expenses between their mission choice and Jill's pregnancies/deliveries

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, SassyPants said:

I was just wondering why she limits her stays to 2-3 days. It’s not like she has an in-person job, and Felicity just started school (maybe last year). 

Lol I would limit my time there too. But I’m a jerk who can’t stand her dad. I wonder if Jer gets tired of it all and always wants to get right back to Cali.

[viii]

Yeah, I think it's unsurprising that Jinger limits her time there. When you're physically distant from the shit show, immersing yourself back into it is overwhelming. She's probably more than ready to go home after 3 days. 

[Mrs. Kravitz]

2 hours ago, SassyPants said:

The only children invited were Duggar and Wissmans- weren’t there Bates’ GKs in attendance

I think they're implying the Bates' brought the kids uninvited.

[SassyPants]

14 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Lol I would limit my time there too. But I’m a jerk who can’t stand her dad. I wonder if Jer gets tired of it all and always wants to get right back to Cali.

I just assumed Jer wouldn’t make those trips (the ones not associated with a wedding or other life altering event). I just cannot see Jer wanting to hang out anywhere near the Duggar clan or in Arkansas.

[JermajestyDuggar]

So do we think Felicity goes to Legacy Christian Academy? Since that’s the private school MacArthur’s church promotes?

[QuiverFullofBooks]

5 hours ago, Mrs. Kravitz said:

I think they're implying the Bates' brought the kids uninvited.

The Bates kids were definitely invited. When FJ members found the wedding website and searched for attendees, the Bates family members with children were listed with the number of kids.

 

[Father Son Holy Goat]

6 hours ago, viii said:

Yeah, I think it's unsurprising that Jinger limits her time there. When you're physically distant from the shit show, immersing yourself back into it is overwhelming. She's probably more than ready to go home after 3 days. 

My family is similar, if I ever were mentally healthy enough to go back I’d limit my time. 

[marmalade]

42 minutes ago, QuiverFullofBooks said:

The Bates kids were definitely invited. When FJ members found the wedding website and searched for attendees, the Bates family members with children were listed with the number of kids.

 

I think k they meant littles, like Nathan and Esther's girl. Remember, they had a plated, sit down dinner. Not the best environment for little kids. Best to limit where possible.

[Bluebirdbluebell]

14 hours ago, SassyPants said:

On Today’s Podcast: Jana’s wedding-

It was small- 450 people (J/J’s 1200 people)

It was sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet, sweet

The only children invited were Duggar and Wissmans- weren’t there Bates’ GKs in attendance

Jana was so patient in waiting for the one

Jinger can never get to see all of her sibs on a 2-3 day visit. WHAT- Jinger could stay in Arkansas for 2 weeks- what’s to stop her? Jim Bob?

Jana, Michelle and some of the sisters came to CA for a bridal weekend in Santa Barbara earlier in August

She didn't have time to visit Josh in prison. 😝

Edited September 5 by Bluebirdbluebell

[SassyPants]

Another thing I remember from the podcast. J/J mentioned that they had never been to NE. Did Jer not get married in NE, and if he did, I wonder if the Vuolos did not attend? Also, who was Jer’s buddy? Jinger had Jed, but didn’t Jana have Jason? Did one of the boys have Jer? We also know that Jill had James. Is Justin after James? Didn’t Jinger have Justin? Who did Jessa have? Jill also had Joy. I am confused with the assignments. I also might be missing some J’boys.

[Mrs. Kravitz]

11 hours ago, marmalade said:

I think k they meant littles, like Nathan and Esther's girl. Remember, they had a plated, sit down dinner. Not the best environment for little kids. Best to limit where possible.

Right. It would make sense because I remember seeing that Erin and Chad (who did not attend) just had them listed without the kids, though i don't remember how old their oldest is. I don't know how the online RSVP works, but do they just have you (the invitee) type in the names of who is coming? It's possible invitations went out for John and Mary Smith but they got a response for John, Mary, Susan, and Sarah Smith.

[OHFL2009]

43 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

Another thing I remember from the podcast. J/J mentioned that they had never been to NE. Did Jer not get married in NE, and if he did, I wonder if the Vuolos did not attend? Also, who was Jer’s buddy? Jinger had Jed, but didn’t Jana have Jason? Did one of the boys have Jer? We also know that Jill had James. Is Justin after James? Didn’t Jinger have Justin? Who did Jessa have? Jill also had Joy. I am confused with the assignments. I also might be missing some J’boys.

According to this website, the buddy teams were:

Jana > Jason, Jackson, Josie

Jill > Joy, James, Jenni

Jessa > Jer, Justin, Jordyn

Jinger > Jed, Johannah

Josh, JD, Joe, and Josiah were not on a buddy team. 

James is a year older than Justin, although Justin is married and James is not. Jer and Hannah did get married in Nebraska, but I can't find any family photos that show which Duggars were at the wedding. Jed, Jason, James and Joe were groomsmen, and Gideon and Ivy were ring bearer and flower girl, so Joy and Jessa were most likely there. 

 

Edited September 5 by OHFL2009