Trump 67: Why Does He Never Suffer Any Significant Consequences?

[St.Clara]

22 hours ago, livinginthelight said:

My first thought was that maybe someone was having a Dietrich Bonhoeffer moment. Bonhoeffer, a German pastor, believed that killing is wrong but that nevertheless Hitler needed to be stopped. He and others were willing to commit what they saw as grave sin in order to make an assassination attempt on Hitler. The attempt failed, and Bonhoeffer wound up being executed.

I don't want to glorify violence. And I am not endorsing it. I see myself primarily as a pacifist. But I am asking myself where the line is. If Trump is elected, many deserving people on the margins of society will lose their safety nets, while others (e.g. the LGBTQ community) will be outright persecuted. IS there a place for violence to stop this? I am so confused right now.

As a German who has felt deeply emotionally affected and horrified by the history of my country I have thought a lot about the 20 July plot. One of the plotters (Henning von Tresckow) clearly stated that it did not matter that much if the chances for succeeding were low (which they actually were, in my opinion) but that the German resistance could no longer silently watch a catastrophe unfold and unspeakable crimes being committed without at least trying to do something and show the world that not all Germans supported Hitler. Even if it cost them their lives. In that I think he was absolutely correct, speaking from the point of view of a grandchild of the Nazi generation. For a long time in my life, it felt a heavy shameful burden to me to be born a German. I do not know how I would have managed to come out the other side without the awareness of at least a few Germans having stood up for all that is good in this world.

That being said, I don´t think that it would have been a good thing if they had succeeded. This may sound strange and shocking so I want to explain why I have come to believe that. One reason for Hitler´s ascension to power was the so-called „Dolchstoßlegende“, the idea that Germany would have won World War I but for evil German socialists betraying Germany from within. That was complete nonsense but if many people want to believe in a lie because the lie soothes their hurt feelings that lie can be pretty powerful. You yourselves have experienced first hand with the allegedly stolen election how that happens and how that feels.

If the 20 July plot had succeeded I think there would have been another „Dolchstoßlegende“. World War II was already lost for Germany in summer 1944, the plotters who were military knew that quite well. If they had succeeded they would immediately have made peace. Although that would have been the best and, frankly, only rational way to act they would have been blamed for it by the majority of Germans at the time. And then maybe, even probably (imo) Germany would, ten years later, have started World War III, would (of course) have lost and been wiped out from the map of the world as a consequence. You could not convince them, you had to defeat them. (I grew up with those people, so I think I know that.)

Donald Trump is a horrible person, no doubt. But Ted Bundy was a horrible person, too, and still never brought you close to losing your democracy. Your main problem is not Trump, imo, but the Republican party who has completely betrayed their values and the brainwashed voters who think Trump is the messiah. Killing Trump would not solve that problem but – in my opinion – rather enhance it.

When you are fighting for democracy you cannot afford to become like your enemy. If you do, you lose even if you win.

Praying for you and the whole world.

You saved us from fascism for which I will be eternally grateful. There actually were admirers of Hitler in the US at the time, but ultimately your better self prevailed and you did the right thing as a nation. I hope and trust that you can save yourselves, too, even if it may be very hard.

Edited July 15 by St.Clara

[libgirl2]

25 minutes ago, noseybutt said:

Probably standing is not comfortable for him either because of painful feet or some sort of mild neuropathy. Maybe he finally has bone spurs for realz.

RE the vacating the documents case. Horrific. He keeps benefiting from power and privilege and it’s disturbing to watch.

 

Some are saying it is the hand of God, I think it is the opposite. 

[AnywhereButHere]

JD Vance is the VP pick. Oh joy.

[libgirl2]

17 minutes ago, AnywhereButHere said:

JD Vance is the VP pick. Oh joy.

I'm just still gobsmacked that this is all going on. 

At the library I work at, we were going to give away a book called Hitlerland. It is a collection of American eyewitness accounts to the rise of the Nazis. I just checked it out. I thought it would be very timely all things considered. 

Edited July 15 by libgirl2

[libgirl2]

1 hour ago, St.Clara said:

As a German who has felt deeply emotionally affected and horrified by the history of my country I have thought a lot about the 20 July plot. One of the plotters (Henning von Tresckow) clearly stated that it did not matter that much if the chances for succeeding were low (which they actually were, in my opinion) but that the German resistance could no longer silently watch a catastrophe unfold and unspeakable crimes being committed without at least trying to do something and show the world that not all Germans supported Hitler. Even if it cost them their lives. In that I think he was absolutely correct, speaking from the point of view of a grandchild of the Nazi generation. For a long time in my life, it felt a heavy shameful burden to me to be born a German. I do not know how I would have managed to come out the other side without the awareness of at least a few Germans having stood up for all that is good in this world.

That being said, I don´t think that it would have been a good thing if they had succeeded. This may sound strange and shocking so I want to explain why I have come to believe that. One reason for Hitler´s ascension to power was the so-called „Dolchstoßlegende“, the idea that Germany would have won World War I but for evil German socialists betraying Germany from within. That was complete nonsense but if many people want to believe in a lie because the lie soothes their hurt feelings that lie can be pretty powerful. You yourselves have experienced first hand with the allegedly stolen election how that happens and how that feels.

If the 20 July plot had succeeded I think there would have been another „Dolchstoßlegende“. World War II was already lost for Germany in summer 1944, the plotters who were military knew that quite well. If they had succeeded they would immediately have made peace. Although that would have been the best and, frankly, only rational way to act they would have been blamed for it by the majority of Germans at the time. And then maybe, even probably (imo) Germany would, ten years later, have started World War III, would (of course) have lost and been wiped out from the map of the world as a consequence. You could not convince them, you had to defeat them. (I grew up with those people, so I think I know that.)

Donald Trump is a horrible person, no doubt. But Ted Bundy was a horrible person, too, and still never brought you close to losing your democracy. Your main problem is not Trump, imo, but the Republican party who has completely betrayed their values and the brainwashed voters who think Trump is the messiah. Killing Trump would not solve that problem but – in my opinion – rather enhance it.

When you are fighting for democracy you cannot afford to become like your enemy. If you do, you lose even if you win.

Praying for you and the whole world.

You saved us from fascism for which I will be eternally grateful. There actually were admirers of Hitler in the US at the time, but ultimately your better self prevailed and you did the right thing as a nation. I hope and trust that you can save yourselves, too, even if it may be very hard.

My husband has said many times, killing trump won't solve the real problem. Someone else will just take his spot. The whole Republican party is rotten. 

[Loveday]

1 hour ago, St.Clara said:

As a German who has felt deeply emotionally affected and horrified by the history of my country I have thought a lot about the 20 July plot. One of the plotters (Henning von Tresckow) clearly stated that it did not matter that much if the chances for succeeding were low (which they actually were, in my opinion) but that the German resistance could no longer silently watch a catastrophe unfold and unspeakable crimes being committed without at least trying to do something and show the world that not all Germans supported Hitler. Even if it cost them their lives. In that I think he was absolutely correct, speaking from the point of view of a grandchild of the Nazi generation. For a long time in my life, it felt a heavy shameful burden to me to be born a German. I do not know how I would have managed to come out the other side without the awareness of at least a few Germans having stood up for all that is good in this world.

That being said, I don´t think that it would have been a good thing if they had succeeded. This may sound strange and shocking so I want to explain why I have come to believe that. One reason for Hitler´s ascension to power was the so-called „Dolchstoßlegende“, the idea that Germany would have won World War I but for evil German socialists betraying Germany from within. That was complete nonsense but if many people want to believe in a lie because the lie soothes their hurt feelings that lie can be pretty powerful. You yourselves have experienced first hand with the allegedly stolen election how that happens and how that feels.

If the 20 July plot had succeeded I think there would have been another „Dolchstoßlegende“. World War II was already lost for Germany in summer 1944, the plotters who were military knew that quite well. If they had succeeded they would immediately have made peace. Although that would have been the best and, frankly, only rational way to act they would have been blamed for it by the majority of Germans at the time. And then maybe, even probably (imo) Germany would, ten years later, have started World War III, would (of course) have lost and been wiped out from the map of the world as a consequence. You could not convince them, you had to defeat them. (I grew up with those people, so I think I know that.)

Donald Trump is a horrible person, no doubt. But Ted Bundy was a horrible person, too, and still never brought you close to losing your democracy. Your main problem is not Trump, imo, but the Republican party who has completely betrayed their values and the brainwashed voters who think Trump is the messiah. Killing Trump would not solve that problem but – in my opinion – rather enhance it.

When you are fighting for democracy you cannot afford to become like your enemy. If you do, you lose even if you win.

Praying for you and the whole world.

You saved us from fascism for which I will be eternally grateful. There actually were admirers of Hitler in the US at the time, but ultimately your better self prevailed and you did the right thing as a nation. I hope and trust that you can save yourselves, too, even if it may be very hard.

Thank you for writing this. ❤️ It deserves to be posted all over the internet.* I was reading it aloud to my husband, but when I got to the last paragraph, I had to stop because I was getting choked up. 

 

*Not to worry, I would never take anything from here and post it anywhere else! ❤️ 

[GreyhoundFan]

6 hours ago, yeahthatsme74 said:

https://apnews.com/article/trump-classified-documents-smith-c66d5ffb7ba86c1b991f95e89bdeba0c

 

I just can't. 🤬

I've seen assertions that this was Aileen Canon's application for SCOTUS should TFG win in November.

 

I've been out of pocket for a few days. I just can't believe the crap going on.

And Vance is not a surprise.  He wants a total sycophant, that's what he'll get.

[Giraffe]

1 hour ago, libgirl2 said:

My husband has said many times, killing trump won't solve the real problem. Someone else will just take his spot. The whole Republican party is rotten. 

Yup! That's the whole point of Project 2025.

[GreyhoundFan]

 

 

Edited July 15 by GreyhoundFan

[GreyhoundFan]

I hope this happens:

 

[livinginthelight]

2 hours ago, St.Clara said:

As a German who has felt deeply emotionally affected and horrified by the history of my country I have thought a lot about the 20 July plot. One of the plotters (Henning von Tresckow) clearly stated that it did not matter that much if the chances for succeeding were low (which they actually were, in my opinion) but that the German resistance could no longer silently watch a catastrophe unfold and unspeakable crimes being committed without at least trying to do something and show the world that not all Germans supported Hitler. Even if it cost them their lives. In that I think he was absolutely correct, speaking from the point of view of a grandchild of the Nazi generation. For a long time in my life, it felt a heavy shameful burden to me to be born a German. I do not know how I would have managed to come out the other side without the awareness of at least a few Germans having stood up for all that is good in this world.

That being said, I don´t think that it would have been a good thing if they had succeeded. This may sound strange and shocking so I want to explain why I have come to believe that. One reason for Hitler´s ascension to power was the so-called „Dolchstoßlegende“, the idea that Germany would have won World War I but for evil German socialists betraying Germany from within. That was complete nonsense but if many people want to believe in a lie because the lie soothes their hurt feelings that lie can be pretty powerful. You yourselves have experienced first hand with the allegedly stolen election how that happens and how that feels.

If the 20 July plot had succeeded I think there would have been another „Dolchstoßlegende“. World War II was already lost for Germany in summer 1944, the plotters who were military knew that quite well. If they had succeeded they would immediately have made peace. Although that would have been the best and, frankly, only rational way to act they would have been blamed for it by the majority of Germans at the time. And then maybe, even probably (imo) Germany would, ten years later, have started World War III, would (of course) have lost and been wiped out from the map of the world as a consequence. You could not convince them, you had to defeat them. (I grew up with those people, so I think I know that.)

Donald Trump is a horrible person, no doubt. But Ted Bundy was a horrible person, too, and still never brought you close to losing your democracy. Your main problem is not Trump, imo, but the Republican party who has completely betrayed their values and the brainwashed voters who think Trump is the messiah. Killing Trump would not solve that problem but – in my opinion – rather enhance it.

When you are fighting for democracy you cannot afford to become like your enemy. If you do, you lose even if you win.

Praying for you and the whole world.

You saved us from fascism for which I will be eternally grateful. There actually were admirers of Hitler in the US at the time, but ultimately your better self prevailed and you did the right thing as a nation. I hope and trust that you can save yourselves, too, even if it may be very hard.

Thank you for your thoughtful response and your deep wisdom. What you say rings true, and brought tears to my eyes. I pray that the hope and trust you hold for us will be affirmed by our ultimate actions as a country. You have more faith in us than I do right now, which gives me something to hang onto when I get too discouraged. 

[Ozlsn]

16 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

BUT at least for once the people promoting that BS get a taste of what that truly means instead of going around promoting sandy hook didn't happen or "if I had been there I would have X" or whatever fucked up excuse they have.

All I can say is I'm glad they didn't allow weapons into the event because otherwise there would have been a bloodbath. Multiple "good guys with guns" misreading the situation, shooting other good guys with guys, taking out people who were in the wrong place, being shot by the Secret service who were trying to ascertain who was the actual threat - total disaster.

6 hours ago, libgirl2 said:

I commend President Biden for his statements and his behavior after this happened. I would hope the same from the orange guy, but I doubt it. 

Trump went to play golf. Didn't go and visit the injured, or the family of the guy who was shot. Will probably send them some of his new merch, maybe. If they can't see by now that the only thing he cares about is himself then they are blind 

[Alisamer]

1 hour ago, GreyhoundFan said:

 

And Vance is not a surprise.  He wants a total sycophant, that's what he'll get.

I think Vance was a strategic pick - he was a Marine. So he shores up the gap Trump made with his "suckers and losers" comments and draft dodging, for the ardent military supporters who found those things distasteful.

[GreyhoundFan]

[GreyhoundFan]

 

[SPHASH]

12 hours ago, Jana814 said:

They usually do. Dr. Ruth, Shannon Doherty, Shelly Duval &  James B Skippie all have died  in last few days.  

Benji Gregory aka Brian from ALF.

6 hours ago, libgirl2 said:

He is my favorite president. He wasn't perfect but I like him. I used to watch Family Affair and I adored Brian Keith. He played Roosevelt in The Wind and the Lion. It kind of went from there. 

Teddy's cousin FDR is my favorite.  He wasn't perfect either especially with race relations but he brought a lot of good things...overtime pay, minimum wage, 40 hour work week, banned child labor, Social Security, WPA, CCC, FDIC, SEC.  All of which Project 2025 want to abolish. He was also a good wartime POTUS who correctly saw that Hitler was a threat when the rest of the country didnt.

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

Trump is the figurehead for sure. What troubles me is what is the money and power behind all this that has almost all the republicans scrambling to lick boots.  If trump was killed I'm sure they have alternates  but there certainly has been magic for the people behind the curtain in the combination of trump and disillusioned uneducated white (mostly) males. 

[LongTimeLurkerOG]

7 hours ago, Ozlsn said:

All I can say is I'm glad they didn't allow weapons into the event because otherwise there would have been a bloodbath. Multiple "good guys with guns" misreading the situation, shooting other good guys with guys, taking out people who were in the wrong place, being shot by the Secret service who were trying to ascertain who was the actual threat - total disaster.

Trump went to play golf. Didn't go and visit the injured, or the family of the guy who was shot. Will probably send them some of his new merch, maybe. If they can't see by now that the only thing he cares about is himself then they are blind 

A bloodbath... Like agent orange threatened for this country. That's the sh**ty rhetoric. 

They're completely blind. And I know some people who still say they'll vote for the felon. Makes me feel sick. 

[GreyhoundFan]

 

[GreyhoundFan]

Sleepy strikes again:

I'm not so sure about this note, he appeared to be sleeping for a lot longer than the length of a prayer.

Edited July 16 by GreyhoundFan

[GreyhoundFan]

 

[GreyhoundFan]

 

[apple1]

13 minutes ago, GreyhoundFan said:

 

To add a little bit of inside humor - or irony, or something - this photo is making internet rounds, with the statement that this bandaging is what you get if the doctor puts the bandage on, instead of letting the nurses - who actually know how - do it. Gotta admit it sounds plausible.

[thoughtful]

It looks like an unused tea bag to me.

[Audrey2]

46 minutes ago, GreyhoundFan said:

 

This picture reminds me of working with my beloved primary students. They love to come up to me and say, "I need a Band-Aid." When I investigate they either have no active blood at all or with their tightest squeezing they can produce a couple of drops requiring a very teeny bandage instead of the full size bandage. The size of this bandage looks very performative to me.