Jana's B`Day

[Lostie]

Wow, you guys are all really impressive. I'm Jill's age (so a year younger than Jana), but I'm nowhere near where any of you are. Mine reads like this:

I am Jill's age/one year younger than Jana and I:

- am in my second year studying political science at university

- live at home, but pay for my tuition & and everything else I need except food

- have had a few jobs (but am currently unemployed)

- have traveled to Spain with a group and a few places within North America on my own

- have a few close friends that I talk to and hang out with

That's it. Certainly I'm not as inexperienced in the world as Jana or Jill, but I'm not nearly as impressive as any of you.

[Mamajane]

I am 24....but when i was Jana's age...

-completed cosmetology school and was licensed

-had my cna (certified nursing assistant license)

-Enrolled in college for my nursing degree (rn)

-Pregnant (turned 22 in late spring and gave birth in early fall)

-married to my best friend (had been together almost 4 years)

I feel like I have done so much more than her at the age of 22.....funny thing is im 24, and i have completed all that i have wanted to with my schooling but now im focused on being a stay at home mother and we are going to start trying for our second child when our first turns 3. Im grateful to have schooling under my belt because when the kids are in school I will go back to work and start my career. Im glad I have that option. She has no schooling and once she is wifed she will have no say :( makes me sad.

[Lana]

Wow, the posts in this thread are a bit self-congratulatory.

While I personally don't want all aspects of Jana's life, there are some things that she has done in her 22 years that impress me. I don't think there is one way that all 22 year olds SHOULD live.

She has traveled to Guatemala, Peru, and Southeast Asia. With her family, she has traveled to England, Ireland, and Israel. She has close-knit relationships with her sisters.

I think Jana looks sad at times but maybe she is just quietly biding her time. I am also starting to think that she does not want to court or marry as she wants to continue to travel and live (somewhat) for herself.

[Witsec7]

Wow, the posts in this thread are a bit self-congratulatory.....

Why? Because they are examples of young women living self directed lives in the real world and not depending on their parents fame whoring for income and exposure?

[Lana]

Why? Because they are examples of young women living self directed lives in the real world and not depending on their parents fame whoring for income and exposure?

Nope, because I don't like the notion that there is only one way to live. That mentality is just as problematic, IMO, as what fundies think--that all young unmarried women should stay at home and wait for their husbands.

[Witsec7]

Nope, because I don't like the notion that there is only one way to live. That mentality is just as problematic, IMO, as what fundies think--that all young unmarried women should stay at home and wait for their husbands.

Hmm I didn't see any of our posters on this thread expressing their way of life was the only way. Admittedly I may have missed something. Perhaps you would be kind enough to cut and paste those posts that support your posit?

riffle

[Daenerys]

Hmm I didn't see any of our posters on this thread expressing their way of life was the only way. Admittedly I may have missed something. Perhaps you would be kind enough to cut and paste those posts that support your posit?

riffle

I think the point was we were all posting the DIFFERENT experiences we have had before 22 to that are denied to Jana, to make a point of how much she is missing out on.

[Witsec7]

I think the point was we were all posting the DIFFERENT experiences we have had before 22 to that are denied to Jana, to make a point of how much she is missing out on.

Its not like Jana had a rumspringa or a view of the 'outside' world that wasn't demonized. Her parents lifestyle, which has been imposed on her, is limiting. The folks posting their experiences at the same age appear to have had choices. Choices that are not options in Jana's world.

[Markie]

Yes, Jana has done a lot in her 22 years. She has:

-raised (trained) her younger siblings

-learned to play the violin, harp and piano

-learned to cook like a low-grade caterer

-travelled throughout the US, South America, SE Asia, Euope and Irsael

-taught her siblings at the SOTDRT

-went on mission trips and Journeys of the Hear (not sure if the latter one was by choice)

-learned to sew night dresses and night caps a la Laura Ingalls Wilder before puberty

-has changed more diapers than the average woman, not working in daycare, ever will

These are all things that I have noticed Jana has accomplished. She undoubtably has accomplished more and will continue to do so. Jana has done extensively more child care than I have and I am her mother's age! She may not want any post-secondary education; not everyone does. I think it would be more of a shame if she really did want to continue her educaton and was denied that opportunity due to feelings of guilt if she left her family or outright threats of banishment if she chose a career contrary to any Gothard approved for young women. Of the Fab Four Duggar girls, Jana has my most sympathy. She is shy and quiet and appears to take everything. Jill, Jessa and Jinger all speak up a bit more for themselves. Perhaps Jana would be amused by my sympathy and is perfectly happy in her life. Who knows? It is not like she is apt to come on FJ and give us her own account.

[ElphabaGalinda]

I think the point was we were all posting the DIFFERENT experiences we have had before 22 to that are denied to Jana, to make a point of how much she is missing out on.

Yes, this exactly. People are saying all the many DIFFERENT opportunities they've had at around Jana's age, and pointing out that Jana hasn't really done anything different with her life than she did as a young teen. Because she's not allowed. I don't think there's only one way to live, there are many. However, i do think that waiting at home for your future husband who many never exist while doing absolutelynothing else, is a very sad way to live. And that makes me sad for Jana because she probably doesn't see other options.

I don't think Jana has to do anything in particular, but it would be nice for her to have the chance to do SOMETHING other than raising her mother's children and doing chores.

Jana may be happy with how she lives, but i highly doubt that all the girls in her family are/will be. It's just statistically imposible they all want the same thing. And they have no choice. For all girls in that lifestyle it's how Jana lives, or nothing. They are taught they have no other options.

[AcidMolybdate]

This is what makes me sad about the Duggar kids ... I'm the same age as Josh and I can't help but compare our lives. (or my own to that of the Daughters ... being a girl myself)

- I am close with my sister (there's only one)

- I am close with my parents

- I volunteer

- I can cook, do laundry, budget, do minor repairs on my car / around the house, babysit children and not kill them, etc.

BUT I've also got two degrees, have been living on my own since 17, traveled to different countries, lived in 4 different provinces (and 1 territory ... yes, I'm from Canland).

Having independence didn't rob me of any of these "good character qualities."

(sidenote: I also cook healthy meals, full of fresh ingredients - nothing comes from a can or frozen. TTC = yuck)

[Lana]

Hmm I didn't see any of our posters on this thread expressing their way of life was the only way. Admittedly I may have missed something. Perhaps you would be kind enough to cut and paste those posts that support your posit?

YMMV, that is just how I read it. The use of the words "should" and "sad" is what gave it that tone for me.

I agree that choice is a big deal and I hope Jana, now at 22, truly decides what she wants and makes it happen whatever that may be (SAHD or out on her own working and catching up so she can go to school). I hope this year is a good one for her.

[FJismyheadship]

When I was Jana's age

I had lived on my own for about eight months

I was in my first relationship ever

I had graduated high school and tried a year of college

I had three jobs

Moved away from my mother halfway across the country

Theres more, but I'm going around the time of my birthday which is only two months away from Jana's, so we're going about this time of year almost two years ago.

[gustava]

This is what makes me sad about the Duggar kids ... I'm the same age as Josh and I can't help but compare our lives. (or my own to that of the Daughters ... being a girl myself)

- I am close with my sister (there's only one)

- I am close with my parents

- I volunteer

- I can cook, do laundry, budget, do minor repairs on my car / around the house, babysit children and not kill them, etc.

BUT I've also got two degrees, have been living on my own since 17, traveled to different countries, lived in 4 different provinces (and 1 territory ... yes, I'm from Canland).

Having independence didn't rob me of any of these "good character qualities."

(sidenote: I also cook healthy meals, full of fresh ingredients - nothing comes from a can or frozen. TTC = yuck)

Welcome to FJ.

[O Latin]

I am Jana's age.

-I'm a senior (ish) in college

-I live in my own apartment, all by myself (although my parents pay for it)

-I'm thinking about grad school

-I'm seeing a therapist to help me deal with my anxiety issues so that I can do things like get a job

-I have only ever gone out with two guys, and kissed one. I am not in a relationship and don't expect to be in one any time soon.

I threw that last one in there to show that there ARE a lot of different experiences around here. I am probably only a tiny little step ahead of Jana in terms of romantic experience. But my lack of experience is my own choice, because dating just does not interest me, not because of any religious belief.

[Boogalou]

I'm a bit younger than Jana but by my age I have:

-Never been asked if I know-a about Noah

-Never been subjected to STOTDRT as "taught" by Michelle or her computer programs

-Learned evolution from those who practice "circular reasoning" by dating fossils from rocks and rocks from fossils

I consider these to be great accomplishments

[Undesigned]

I am going to have to back up Lana's statement about the 'accomplishment' posts being self congratulatory. They definitely read that way, and oddly enough they were mostly just things society, or your parent would finance and have you do. Everyone was happy to chime in and recount the privileged lives they had by 22. Jana is suppressed by her parents, while many (NOT most) are supported by theirs. In this world, going to school is a privilege more than an accomplishment. Traveling to Europe, foreign nations is rather a thing of privilege, NOT an accomplishment. Sorry. Deny, deny, deny but they (the first 3 or 4 for sure) were people giving themselves pats on the back and you know it.

[moreorlessnu]

Very interesting points Undesigned. Do we have examples of fundie women who have managed to accomplish something despite of and with respect to their sheltered, closed-in worlds? The first one that comes to mind is Anna Marie with her business selling goat milk soap.

Even Sarah Malley lives a relatively interesting life while operating within the confines of her lifestyle.

[Witsec7]

Very interesting points Undesigned. Do we have examples of fundie women who have managed to accomplish something despite of and with respect to their sheltered, closed-in worlds? The first one that comes to mind is Anna Marie with her business selling goat milk soap.

Even Sarah Malley lives a relatively interesting life while operating within the confines of her lifestyle.

Heck based on those standards you can call the Botkin girls career women :lol:

[Boogalou]

I think it depends on what you mean by "accomplish something". Is writing a successful blog, raising Godly arrows for your quiver, dressing in a modest manner consistently, growing in your relationship with Jesus/God, memorizing parts of the Bible, becoming a good sewer, writing books, becoming a good cook, selling cheesecakes, bush hogging, painting, drawing, decorating, writing a book, researching your brothers' Egypt project, home schooling your children/siblings, having a clean home, lighting scented candles, or finding a husband accomplishing something? To many of the fundies it would be.

And my statement was definitely self congratulatory. I am super proud that no one has ever asked me if I know-a about Noah. I can't help myself.

[mockingbird]

Very interesting points Undesigned. Do we have examples of fundie women who have managed to accomplish something despite of and with respect to their sheltered, closed-in worlds? The first one that comes to mind is Anna Marie with her business selling goat milk soap.

Even Sarah Malley lives a relatively interesting life while operating within the confines of her lifestyle.

Razing Ruth? I think she is pretty accomplished (especially having come from that background) and I respect her a lot for having the courage to leave and make her own decisions.

People still in the movement - Breezy Brookshire seems to have a decent art/illustration business going with her paper dolls and etsy store.

O Latin - I am the same age and I haven't really dated much either. It was my choice in high school but not in college, I just haven't met anyone yet where it's worked out. I do want to date/have a relationship so I hope I meet someone soon!

[countressrascal]

When I was her age I just completed my Peace Corp training was getting ready to leave to work in Tanzania for two years.

[Lostie]

When I was her age I just completed my Peace Corp training was getting ready to leave to work in Tanzania for two years.

The actual Tanzania, not the Makaziville one I assume :lol:

[Witsec7]

Self supporting college grad at her age. Took some time off from law school to go to North Africa, Spain, Turkey, Egypt and Afghanistan. I had been to hundreds of rock and roll shows by that age, seen hundreds of Broadway shows, live symphonies, ballets. I also participated in politics, nonviolent civil actions, and crossed the country a few times. I could drive, shoot, tune a car, vote, cook excellent meals, entertain in my own home and generally come and go as I pleased. I stopped submitting to my parents authority at the age of 18, consequently I was on the pill at 21, learning to enjoy sex and my own body.I also owned a piece of a company that produced rock and roll and I had half ownership in a race horse, as well as owned my first home. I surfed the east and west coasts by that age, and I briefly taught disadvantaged youth. Oh I also got to read any book of my choosing, see any film I want to view.

And I knew what my own cervix looked like.

[Queen of Serpents]

Very interesting points Undesigned. Do we have examples of fundie women who have managed to accomplish something despite of and with respect to their sheltered, closed-in worlds? The first one that comes to mind is Anna Marie with her business selling goat milk soap.

Even Sarah Malley lives a relatively interesting life while operating within the confines of her lifestyle.

Goat's milk Soap! Link?