Do you think Michelle will ever get pregnant with number 20?

[TheJewAmongUs]

I think Michelle's done. I wouldn't have been surprised if Josie's birth brought additional surgery with it.

I was wondering about this. If she had to get a partial hysterectomy or something, would it ever be mentioned publicly, or would they stay "on message."

Like when you read headlines saying there might be #20 and it's because some interviewer asked and she gives a stock answer like, "We'd welcome another if He saw fit." Well, of course you got the answer you wanted, you knew before you asked the question!

ETA: Is it just me, or do the Bateses' cousins seem decidedly non-fundie?

[daharyn]

EGADS! I think you're right!

I can only imagine that after a rather public miscarriage they won't announce until she's further along. And posting the news of Zach's courtship keeps the eyes of their blog readers helpfully pointed in another direction, no?

[daharyn]

ETA: Is it just me, or do the Bateses' cousins seem decidedly non-fundie?

Sometimes, their girls wear shorts! And leggings!

They seem conservative, to me, but not fundie.

[failsafe]

But it's really hard. The chances of getting pregnant dwindle after 27, and the chance of complications rises. As my doctor likes to tell me, I am not a spring chicken anymore. I'm about a decade younger than Michelle!

27? Ahh! I thought I had until at least 30 before I had to worry. I don't even want to start until I'm 28 or so and that's only if Everything Goes According to Plan. I may be super fertile now (23) but I have no interest in a baby. Sigh.

[Brainsample]

Brainsample: I'm really sorry for your fertility and health troubles. I apologize if my comments were hurtful to you or anyone else who has had trouble getting or staying pregnant.

I'm not hurt, I just read that whole thing from a different perspective. Now that I'm over 40 and as I'm only a couple of months shy of 45, I'm less and less hurt by it. I may have a good cry on my birthday, though, and be done with it. I just brought it up because it is a good example of how our vantage affects how we take info and what we do with it. If I were looking 35 and planning to have a few more kids, I'd probably be pretty ticked off and would see the whole thing in a different light.

I appreciate it, though. :) I didn't take what you said as something offensive at all. It was more of a disclaimer.

You made a good point though, which I failed to mention before about arriving at the right conclusions by way of misinterpreting the data. You can only say what the data really means, no more and no less, as a researcher (if you want to be entirely ethical). And the conclusions are the same in this case -- have kids early because there are no guarantees, and you're likely to be more fertile when you're younger. This, of course, doesn't mean that you won't be adequately fertile later or at all. It all depends on how you present the data sometimes, and the way an attorney couches the numbers and what they mean has a dramatic affect on how juries interpret matters in court. You can say the same thing in different terms using different examples, and a jury can go 180 degrees in the opposite direction with a verdict, even though the numbers are the same.

AND how sad is this? There's actually a part of me that feels bad for Michelle, considering how much of her life she's invested in having babies. If she gets to 20, just because it's a round number and a multiple of ten, it would have to give her more satisfaction than 19. I can relate to that. And then the other, more rational part of me will be happy if she doesn't, for obvious reasons. It's just all so weird, and it's sad whether they have another baby or not.

[MrsKay]

I highly doubt it. I think her fertility has been Raptured - or at least, I hope so. Not only is Josie way older than any of her siblings were before becoming big brothers/sisters, Michelle also stopped breastfeeding her (well, pumping, but YKWIM) much earlier than she normally says she does, since Josie couldn't handle her milk. I would imagine the early stopping of lactation made them think #20 would be closer to Josie than they expected, but so far, nothing doing.

I think that:

Michelle has hit menopause (moodier than usual?)

or

They're using NFP or the old Pull n' Pray method, and just not saying anything

or

Someone got fixed - either on purpose, or as a side effect of Josie's birth, or Michelle's health issues after

Whichever, I think their little family just might be finished this time.

[muffynbear]

I certainly hope Michelle is done having J'robots. What's wrong with the children she already has? Why can't she be satisfied with 19? That is far too many children, IMO. I think Michelle says that she would love more kids because she HAS to say that. She's programmed to say that she wants more kids. For someone who breeds so irresponsibly without any regard for Mother Earth, I will be thrilled once it's revealed that she can't breed anymore. Her baby makin' days are over, IMO and I'm glad.

[bananacat]

On the gall bladder removal/potential weight loss issue, having your gall bladder removed means that you have to follow a low fat diet (which would be interesting given the abundance of TTC and ramen in the Duggar house). Lower fat - potentially fewer calories - weight loss. Just a thought... I had my gall bladder removed, and lost some weight after as there are foods that cause me intense pain now if I eat too much of them.

I also had my gallbladder removed, ironically after intentionally losing a ton of weight. Did you know that losing weight can cause gall stones? Anyway, I took a course all about metabolism in college and my doctor explained it to me this way. You produce bile which is needed to digest fat and it gets stored in your gall bladder, and it is then released when you eat fat. When you get rid of the gall bladder, you still produce bile but you can't store as much so if you eat too much fat at once, it passes through the intestines undigested, which can be extremely painful. But over the time, the duct that used to connect to the gallbladder can stretch out and expand and actually store some bile for you, although usually less than your gall bladder could. So everyone is affected differently by it and some people have to drastically change their diets while others don't.

For me personally, I really lucked out. I can eat the same as I always have and I don't get any pain from it. I like to eat some fatty foods, but it's usually along with starches so it moves through slower and doesn't give my small intestine a sudden rush of fat. For example, I love pizza and cheese fries. A little after my surgery I wanted to test the limit so I ate some plain sausage and that the was the only time I ever had a bad reaction. I usually eat sausage along with bread or home fries so it hasn't been a problem since then. But my friend who has had her gall bladder removed still has a lot of trouble with things like pizza. So my point is that it's different for everyone but it's possible that Michelle could still be able to eat tater tot casserole with no problem.

[bananacat]

27? Ahh! I thought I had until at least 30 before I had to worry. I don't even want to start until I'm 28 or so and that's only if Everything Goes According to Plan. I may be super fertile now (23) but I have no interest in a baby. Sigh.

Meh, I wouldn't worry about it. My brother and I were both accidents, and my mom was 28 and 33 when we happened. She didn't even try for either of us and got pregnant easily. For every woman who has trouble conceiving, there's another one out there who is more fertile than she wants to be. Every woman is different and there's so much natural variation.

[gustava]

Idle speculation for which I have absolutely no credentials: I think Michelle is clinically depressed and has been for much of her adult life. We all know that for her, being pregnant is her only goal. If she can no longer become pregnant, she no longer has a purpose in life. Even if she were to hit the big 20, she'd want to be pregnant again...and again...

[contrary]

i remember when i was in my late 20s, some article came out on the cover of a newsmagazine about the decline of marriageability/fertility in your 30s. i was nowhere near marriage or babies at that time, and it stressed me. i didn't feel ready for either, but wanted them both at some point in the future.

this is anecdotal, of course, but I was 33 at marriage, and 35 and 37 when i had my children, with no complications (except that baby one was butt-first).

so...don't stress, you twentysomethings and thirtysomethings!

eta: i agree that if michelle can have #20, she will.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

and I think Kelly Bates looks like she's expecting...)

Actually I thought MICHAELA looked that "way" but I imagine she's just pissed off that someone stuck a camera in her face.

[browngrl]

27? Ahh! I thought I had until at least 30 before I had to worry. I don't even want to start until I'm 28 or so and that's only if Everything Goes According to Plan. I may be super fertile now (23) but I have no interest in a baby. Sigh.

No, I do not think you have to panic just yet. A woman's fertility decreases with age. The rate of decrease increases somewhere between your early to mid 30's but the really steep decline is after 40. Remember these are just statistics. Any woman of any age can have issues with fertility and some women are able to have kids (without medical intervention) well into their 40's. At 23 I think you have plenty of time to decide what is best for you - but if having children is a priority for you then think about having children sooner than later.

[Vex]

I've said no since Josie came along. Maybe she'll have more miscarriages (I sincerely hope that's not the case), but I don't think she'll bring another baby to term. I think her biological clock has finally puttered out.

[luckylassie]

I doubt that a number twenty will be coming soon but you never know. Back when they were having number 18 Michelle mentioned that she thought that Jordyn may be the last baby but then came Josie. I don't think they will ever use birth control or deny each other "the deed". There may be a grandduggar number three by next year though.

[Olivia]

I have no idea, but I hope there's no baby #20. I just wouldn't trust them not to try for it anyway, and there's the chance it's still medically possible.

I have people in my family who don't believe in birth control, and you know what? I still just don't get it. Just take some so you can be around for your NINETEEN OTHER CHILDREN.

[takers401]

I actually think they'll get to number 20, but there will be a big gap between the last Duggar baby and Josie. I hear stories about women who have no periods due to being in menopause and then turn up pregnant months/years later. I think Michelle will be like this.

[gustava]

I actually think they'll get to number 20, but there will be a big gap between the last Duggar baby and Josie. I hear stories about women who have no periods due to being in menopause and then turn up pregnant months/years later. I think Michelle will be like this.

But if the poor dear doesn't know when she's having her period, how will the j'slaves be able to chart her cyle, so how will she and Jimboob know when to do it?

Haven't they timed sex to her fertile peak?

Do you think they know how to have spontaneous sex?

[MrsKay]

From what I've read and heard, Michelle is a randy beast. She won't quit if there's even the slightest hope. Oooh, but what if JimBoob needs Viagra soon? Do fundies believe in that stuff???

[Kitten]

Well, to get pregnant (Duggar-style, anyway), you have to do the deed. There wasn't much of that going on with Michelle in Little Rock and JimBob, well, wherever JimBob was. And I suspect that even when they were together, Michelle had little interest - she's got a sick baby in the NICU, she's recovering from a C-section and a bout of pre-eclampsia, she's trying to pump constantly (which she says she's always had trouble with), etc. And, once you don't "use it" for a while, your ability to use it in the future starts deteriorating, for both of them. Even if Michelle's not menopausal, parts, um, start to dry out, and things become a little uncomfortable. And JimBob might find that even imagining her in her pre-frumper glory isn't enough to salute the flag any longer. Then, because of all that, you start to get the "strain" in the relationship, which further reduces their desire to engage. Which starts a vicious spiral downwards to...nothing.

[JenniferJuniper]

I believe Michelle will be 45 in a couple of months.

At about age 40, the changes of getting pregnant in any given month while intentionally trying is only about 5%. That drops off significantly by 45.

According to the Sourthern Cal. Center For Reproductive Medicine:

Pregnancy over 45 is a very difficult proposition. Women over 45 have less than a 1% chance of getting pregnant using their own eggs. This is because virtually all of their remaining eggs are genetically abnormal. Successful pregnancy over 45 is therefore nearly always the result of egg donation. Many high profile women who have become pregnant in their forties, especially after the age of 45 did so with the help of donor eggs. The pregnancy risk over 45 is also increased. In the unlikely event that a woman over 45 becomes pregnant with her own eggs, the pregnancy risk over 45 results in a miscarriage rate of at least 50% and the incidence of a genetically abnormal pregnancy of 1 in 12. There is also a significantly higher risk of maternal and fetal mortality with pregnancy over 45 compared to younger women.

If Michelle does turn up pregnant again, I think it's a safe bet it wasn't left up to God.

[nolongerIFBx]

Not that I view ABC as the best source for medical info, but this was the first thing that popped up:

abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/women-fertility-falls-lose-90-percent-eggs-30/story?id=9693015

And there goes any chance I had of having a good day. Thanks for the encouragement. (from my over 30 years old eggs :character-oldtimer: )

[Buzzard]

I think there will be a 20. The show is still called "and counting." The "counting" part is a major player in their sellability (I know, not a word).

I believe that if her lady parts were taken during Josie's surgery she would have embraced it. She holds herself as a leader and role model to women. She would write a book, go on tour etc all about the new "season of life" that she has entered. She would thank god for giving her a last gift and allowing her to survive etc. I dont see a big media cover up etc.

[Markie]

I don't think Michelle will have another child, but she would if physically able to. Mentally, I think she really wants that 20th kid. I also think she had a couple of miscarriages between Hannie and Jennifer since there's a two year gap between those two. That's the longest spacing since Josh and the twins.

JimBob was genuinely scared when Michelle was rushed to deliver Josie. I don't think he'd be too anxious to have Michlle get pregnant again. If she did get pregant, they would accept and embrace it, pray and hope for a full-term, risk-free delivery. They would also get medical help asap, since they are not like some other fundy families who refuse medical care.

[Feberin]

I think they're trying as hard as they can for number 20. I'm not sure if she will get pregnant again or not due to her age and the C-section. I also wouldn't be shocked if they did choose to adopt #20.